How do we force immigrants to assimilate?

[Argus]

18 hours ago, dialamah said:

I couldn't find a cite to back that statement up, but however true it is, there are reasons for that have to do with people like you.

https://www.ryerson.ca/content/dam/diversity/reports/UARR_2015.pdf

Bullshit. People like me? I'm responsible for Somalis not finding work? How come people from other countries with BROWN people find work at a much higher rate?

How come their unemployment rate is WAY higher than for Ethiopians?

How come Somali men have a higher unemployment rate the longer they're in Canada but Somali women have a lower unemployment rate the longer they're in Canada?

My fault? Bullshit. You're just so eager to blame poor performance on white people. I think your tiny, progressive brain would explode if you ever even considered the possibility they might be responsible for their own shitty behaviour. But you're just too racist and paternalistic to judge them as equals.

As for YOU not being able to find a cite. Hey, maybe you should have just asked instead of jerking your pasty old knee.

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/11f0019m/11f0019m2019007-eng.htm

Edited May 14, 2019 by Argus

[dialamah]

4 minutes ago, Machjo said:

The problem is not immigration but social assistance. If we let them sink or swim, those that can't support themselves would soon be begging to be sent back home.

Why?  Do you think they'd feel better having bombs dropped on them while they starved?  Or maybe being beaten and raped with no chance of legal intervention while begging on the street is preferable to them? 

Not all of them, of course, but many of the people Argus criticizes come from places where employment is low and violence and lawlessness are high.  Why would they "beg to go back"?

The narrative that they are lazy and are only interested in taking advantage of our social assistance system is no more true than the narrative that they're so discriminated against that they can't get a job despite all their best efforts.  Doscrimination amd bigotry play a part, lack of skills and education play a part, and for some "easy living" is no doubt true.  None of those things by themselves is the whole problem, they are all part of the whole.

[dialamah]

2 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Argus has never mentioned doing that - screaming at women in the street.  This is a discussion forum.  

Oh FFS. I did not say that and I do not think he'd do that.  Most people wouldn't.

Stop letting your dislike of me make you stupid.

[dialamah]

4 minutes ago, Argus said:

I'm responsible for Somalis not finding work? How come people from other countries with BROWN people find work at a much higher rate?

Read my response to Goddess and try to be smarter than her.  You hold the view that Muslims are backward, barbaric, unable and unwilling to change and its attitudes like this that make it harder for Somali men to find work, as the study I linked to points out.  It isn't the only factor, of course, but it is one.  

[Argus]

20 hours ago, Machjo said:

You see. If you want to force assimilation, you'll need some pretty draconian measures to do so. Even closing our borders will not prevent conversion to minority religions or people learning unofficial languages and using them and intermarrying, etc. You'll need some pretty tough measures to stop all of that.

Are you done blubbering yet about the real or imagined injustices of the past?

We don't need tough measures. All we need is to be careful about who we let in. No welfare. No pogey. Work or leave. And after say five years, if you haven't developed a level of assimilation then you leave as a failed immigrant and we'll try someone else.

[Argus]

19 hours ago, dialamah said:

Over the weekend, I saw some Mennonite women and girls in their modest dresses and caps.  They, the Amish, the Hutterites, etc. practice a lifestyle that does not accord equality to women, and where abuse and pedophilia are hidden away, the perpetrators protected and victims punished.  They reject Canadian society to the extent that their children are warned away from us (the English) and they refuse to live in our neighborhoods and cities.  Clearly these folks are not Canadian and do not want to be Canadian.  What is your solution to that?

I don't need a solution. They are already here, not a very sizable population, and don't bother anyone else. Now if there were hundreds of thousands and they were doubling in size every ten years and often committing violent crimes we'd have to consider what to do.

[Argus]

19 hours ago, Machjo said:

.So, what is a Canadian?

If you don't know what a Canadian is then maybe you and your wife should consider leaving. You're clearly a globalist, not attached to the place anyway, feel no sense of kinship and would be just as happy somewhere else.

Edited May 14, 2019 by Argus

[Goddess]

4 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Not all of them, of course, but many of the people Argus criticizes come from places where employment is low and violence and lawlessness are high.  Why would they "beg to go back"?

Here's why some go back:

Quote

Following a greatly improved security situation in Somalia in 2012, many Somali residents of Canada have begun returning to Mogadishu and other parts of the country for investment opportunities and to take part in the ongoing post-conflict reconstruction process. Participating in the renovation of schools, hospitals, roads and other infrastructure, they have played a leading role in the capital's recovery and have also helped propel the local real estate market.

 

4 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Stop letting your dislike of me make you stupid.

Stop letting your dislike of Argus make you stupid.  The report says what it says - he didn't make it up.  You can disagree that immigrants should make efforts to assimilate all you want.  But the first thing you did on this thread was blame Argus for their lack of integrating.  And you call me stupid......

[Argus]

3 hours ago, paxamericana said:

Should of adopted the melting pot idea before that mosaic crap if you want people to assimilate. 

Canada has always had the melting pot. The idea of a mosaic is something liberal elites came up with about forty years ago. No one else buys into it. Everyone else wants immigrants to assimilate.

[Argus]

29 minutes ago, dialamah said:

I think some people on this forum are bigots, some are racists, some are racist bigots.  I think they represent the minority of Canadians and I think its acceptable and even necessary to call those people out.  

Two thirds of Canadians are unhappy with immigrants not assimilating enough.

All racists.

40% of Canadians say too many visible minorities are immigrating to Canada - and visible minorities feel this more than whites.

All racists.

56% of Canadians think Canada is too welcoming to immigrants, 54% want immigration lowered, borders tightened, 48% immigrant are changing canada in ways they don't like.

All racists, I'm sure.

68% want immigrants to assimilate better

All racists to dialamah

61 per cent saytoo many minority groups are seeking special treatment these days,”  Another 59 per cent said too many immigrants don’t adopt “Canadian values”

dialamah can't wait to call them all racists

75% want values test for immigrants one third want a muslim ban in quebec, 23% in canada. 60% want immigrants to put aside their culture

More racists, I guess.

68% of Canadians want Quebec's anti face covering ban in their province

Such shocking racism!

Here's what you fanatics from the far fringes of the left don't ever seem to understand. You don't represent Canadians. You don't even know what Canadians are like. You're in your own little bubble world and dismiss any opinions that go against you as some kind of abnormal and extremist fringe. When YOU are the extremist fringe.

 

[Argus]

23 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Read my response to Goddess and try to be smarter than her.  You hold the view that Muslims are backward, barbaric, unable and unwilling to change and its attitudes like this that make it harder for Somali men to find work, as the study I linked to points out.  It isn't the only factor, of course, but it is one.  

How about you answer the questions. How come Ethiopians perform much better than Somalians. How come Somali unemployment GROWS the longer they're in Canada? It couldn't be that they learn how to take advantage of social programs so they don't have to work, could it?

Edited May 14, 2019 by Argus

[dialamah]

7 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Here's why some go back:

Good reason, eh?  "Security improved, investment opportunity".  Clearly you missed the point of my reply to Machjo, which asked whether someone would "beg to go back" to a place with poor security and poor employment.  But hey, change that and suddenly home looks better than easy living in Canada!  Once again proving my point that the simplistic "here to take advantage" is not an accurate statement.

14 minutes ago, Goddess said:

You can disagree that immigrants should make efforts to assimilate all you want. 

Where have I said that?  I said I don't think they can be forced to assimilate, which is an entirely different thing than "make efforts to assimilate". 

But the

 first thing you did on this thread

The comment to which you took so much offense was the fifth post of mine on this thread.  Hardly "the first thing I did" eh.

was blame Argus for their lack of integrating. 

Argus holds the view that Muslims are backward, barbaric, unable and unwilling to change; he has repeated such sentiments often on this forum.  Are you denying that this kind of attitude among some Canadians would make it harder for Muslims to gain employment?  

[paxamericana]

11 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Argus holds the view that Muslims are backward, barbaric, unable and unwilling to change;

Well incase you wanted to keep a scorecard between right wing extremist and islamic fundamentalist that the liberal party haven't been telling you. https://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

Edited May 14, 2019 by paxamericana

[Goddess]

8 minutes ago, dialamah said:

Argus holds the view that Muslims are backward, barbaric, unable and unwilling to change;

Ooooo, progress!  This time, you left out the lie that he thinks ALL Muslims are that way.

[dialamah]

14 minutes ago, Argus said:

Here's what you fanatics from the far fringes of the left don't ever seem to understand

Here is what you fanatics from the far fringes of the right don't ever seem to understand.  Ignorance of the facts by the majority of the population doesn't mean their "opinion" is right. 

Most people don't bother to look at more than the surface: something sounds reasonable "immigrants should assimilate more" so they agree, clueless about how well immigrants actually do assimilate.  That is ignorance and laziness not bigotry. 

You, however, go to great lengths to only present "facts" that demean and marginalize immigrants from certain areas.  That's bigotry and racism.  An example:

You took an Environics survey that says "young Muslims attend Mosque more than their parents" and used that to sound the alarm about Muslim youth becoming more extreme.  At the same time you disregarded the information in that the same survey about Muslim youth also more accepting of homosexuality and strong support for female equality and other progressive Canadian values.  You insist that going to Mosque more must exclude progressive values for Muslims, without, apparently, the slightest clue that this is exactly what "Islamic reform" means:  Muslims with progressive ideas going to Mosque.

[dialamah]

12 minutes ago, paxamericana said:

Well incase you wanted to keep a scorecard between right wing extremist and islamic fundamentalist that the liberal party haven't been telling you. https://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

Thanks.  Here's a link for you:

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/?s=Religionofpeace

 

 

[paxamericana]

Just now, dialamah said:

Thanks.  Here's a link for you:

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/?s=Religionofpeace

 

 

Is this the modern day way of burying your head in the sand? Facts don't care about feelings and opinion I'm afraid. 

[dialamah]

13 minutes ago, Goddess said:

Ooooo, progress!  This time, you left out the lie that he thinks ALL Muslims are that way.

Sadly, no progress for you: still missing the point, still defending bigotry.

[dialamah]

3 minutes ago, paxamericana said:

Is this the modern day way of burying your head in the sand? Facts don't care about feelings and opinion I'm afraid. 

Provide a credible link with facts and maybe we'll have a discussion about those facts.  

[paxamericana]

Just now, dialamah said:

Provide a credible link with facts and maybe we'll have a discussion about those facts.  

No one is stopping you from doing your own research about the number of suicide bombing and terrorist attacks around the world. 

[eyeball]

44 minutes ago, Argus said:

Here's what you fanatics from the far fringes of the left don't ever seem to understand. You don't represent Canadians. You don't even know what Canadians are like. You're in your own little bubble world and dismiss any opinions that go against you as some kind of abnormal and extremist fringe. When YOU are the extremist fringe.

Would someone please ask Argus why he assumes that being extreme is always wrong?

Just because people all around you are freaking out about is no excuse to freak out yourself.

[dialamah]

Just now, paxamericana said:

No one is stopping you from doing your own research about the number of suicide bombing and terrorist attacks around the world. 

This topic isn't about that; its about "forcing assimilation" with a subtext about Somalis who aren't working.  

And I have done that research and have found credible links that aren't just about stoking fear and hatred toward Islam and Muslims.  Here is one. 

[paxamericana]

10 minutes ago, dialamah said:

This topic isn't about that; its about "forcing assimilation" with a subtext about Somalis who aren't working.  

And I have done that research and have found credible links that aren't just about stoking fear and hatred toward Islam and Muslims.  Here is one. 

So using the website you gave, data still point to the same thing... overwhelming Muslim and leftist organization. I don't think refuting these facts is a tenable position to be in imo. So why defend it? Why defend the valid criticism of Islam as a "religion of peace"? Islam needs to reform, specifically when it comes to secularism. This abslutely relates to immigration, the majority of Somalis are Muslims. You think they'll just rescind Sharia law when they come over to Canada....?

 https://www.start.umd.edu/pubs/START_GTD_Overview2017_July2018.pdf

 

Edited May 14, 2019 by paxamericana

[dialamah]

11 minutes ago, paxamericana said:

So using the website you gave, data still point to the same thing... overwhelming MuslimSo using the website you gave, data still point to the same thing... overwhelming Muslim and leftist organization. I don't think refuting these facts is a tenable position to be in imo

I have neither denied Islamic terrorism nor defended it; I merely refused to give a garbage website any credence.  And as mentioned, this topic isn't about  terrorism.

Edited May 14, 2019 by dialamah

[Hal 9000]

I've worked closely with many Muslim men and they all seemed alright, polite to me and my wife and their co-workers - even the females and behave somewhat typical.  That said, these guys all had issues with respecting women - every one.  If any of our female employees rechecked their work, questioned them or had to redo something, then you would see the Islam come out, "you are a woman, you don't disrespect me" and so forth.  That's just the way it is.

Now, Dialamah will pretend that that's the way every man is, but I'm sure she would get a very real awakening if she ever heard muslim men speaking to other men.  It's shocking to even me.  Coming to Canada will not change the way Muslims think, it just wont.  We can claim they're more tolerant of women of gays, but they will never respect women or gays as equals.  So, as Dialamah comes on here every day to defend them, I hope she realizes that every Muslim man (even her brother in law) thinks she's inferior to them...maybe she knows it too.