Canada criticized for failing its poor

[Hawk]

The Liberal Party is now rightwing?  The Liberal Party of abortion at any time during pregnancy (all on the taxpayer's dime)

It's been around a long time before Paul Martin....

, gay marriage,

something the public supports,

anti-Americanism,

A worldwide PUBLIC sentiment, not the position of our Liberal government,

prostitution,

... been around a lot longer than the liberals...

pot-smoking,

Your favourite country's presidents all did it...

George Washington's diary will attest to his like of the herb,

Bill Clinton

George Bush (by reputation)... hypocricy prevents his admitting it...

liberal-leftist fundamentalism,

?????

social programs, more social programs, more social programs,

what do they think the government is for... the people ???

anti-religiosity, anti-family,

... especially those anti-family social programs...

the culture of death, and not being a white man if at all possible is,

... watch out for the men in the white coats...

  according to some of this thread, a rightwing party.

... right wing fiscal policy... if the shoe fits...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The point wasn't how long it existed or who else in the world backed it as well, the point is that the Libs support those things while the Cons don't. Therefore how can you possibly say the Libs are right-wing? I mean, how the bloody h*ll can you call the Cons even right-wing these days? Canada's entire political spectrum is so far left even our most right-wing government is furthur left than the Democrats down south =p

Learn politics before posting.

[err]

The point wasn't how long it existed or who else in the world backed it as well, the point is that the Libs support those things while the Cons don't. Therefore how can you possibly say the Libs are right-wing? I mean, how the bloody h*ll can you call the Cons even right-wing these days? Canada's entire political spectrum is so far left even our most right-wing government is furthur left than the Democrats down south =p

Learn politics before posting.

Learn to use the "quotes" before posting, so people can read your message.

Also, from you arrogant closing line, you assume that you have the "correct" position, and everyone else is wrong... You show your spots when you do this, and diminish any credibility you may have earned by posting reasons... logic... etc...

[Montgomery Burns]

It's been around a long time before Paul Martin....

But he supports it.

something the public supports,

Somthing the public does NOT support. Why do you think the Canadian left breaks into hysteria at the very mention of a referendum? They know how the people voted in 11 American states on Nov 2/2004.

A worldwide PUBLIC sentiment, not the position of our Liberal government,

Bull. There are people all over the world embracing and devouring American culture. Indeed, people are clamoring to live in the US.

Your claim that the Liberal Party position is not anti-Americanism is sheer insanity.

... been around a lot longer than the liberals...

Please tell us about the former Canadian govts that imported prostitutes and exotic dancers to Canada. Enquiring minds want to know.

Your favourite country's presidents all did it...

George Washington's diary will attest to his like of the herb,

Bill Clinton

George Bush (by reputation)... hypocricy prevents his admitting it...

Another over-the-top claim. ALL American presidents smoked pot? Provide a source for your wild claim.

what do they think the government is for... the people ???

Govts are supposed to be "for the people"? Maybe so. I hear that all you have to do to collect welfare in my province is phone a govt agency and tell them you need welfare. Apparently, they send you the money as soon as you are done the telephone interview. Govt: it's for the people.

... especially those anti-family social programs...

You are correct. The govt-run taxpayer-funded, union govt worker controlled socialist healthcare system is anti-family. Ditto for gay "marriage".

... watch out for the men in the white coats...

Be calm and they won't hurt you.

[Montgomery Burns]

err:

The overly simplistic "right wing" answers distort the issues to be a "hand-out to those who refuse to work" type attitude.... the straw-man argument.

Gotcha.

Rightwingers are just too goshdarned stupid and simple to understand that leftwing "nuance".

[mcqueen625]

Canada criticized for failing its poor

Inequality and homelessness are rising in Canada despite a sustained economic boom and repeated federal promises to cut poverty, says an international study.

Poverty is rising among children and new immigrants, the middle class is finding it increasingly difficult to afford education and housing, and there are 250,000 Canadians living on the streets, says the study by Social Watch, a coalition of 400 non-government organizations from 50 countries.

A weak federal government has consistently cut taxes for the well-off rather than investing in social services, says the study, released yesterday in New York.

"We're worse off now than we were when we wrote the 1948 declaration of human rights," aid Armine Yalnizyan, an economist with the Canadian Centre for Policy Alternatives, who wrote the Canadian section of the report.

I don't know about the rest of you but I am tired of being lied to by these right wing governments, and these right wing fronts for the corporate community like the Fraser Institute. I actually think all these think tanks should be abolished and they should all be investigated by our governments. Every week they churn out their drivel in the corporate press often with no explanation of who they are and who they represent. All these economists and accountants will tell you things are booming in Canada. Well where, and for whom? These facts speak for themselves. Many, many Canadians are worse off than they have ever been.

It is time to put an end to this corporate takeover of our society, with their special tax loopholes and get a government that is going to look after all segments of society, not just the rich and powerful, because Canadians are not being protected and way too many are falling between the cracks.

I sit here and listen to a lot of you drone on about tax cuts. Absurd. If we can't protect our citizens with the money the government presently takes in then let's raise taxes, not lower them. Our leaders are failing us big time across this land.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The problem with raising taxes as you suggest will just make it worse for the very poor, and working poor in this country, because government's are not about to bite the hand that feeds them, namely the multinational corporations. Any tax raise will hit you-know-who, and I don't mean their business friends.

[mcqueen625]

How did the aboriginal peoples get dragged into this? There are just as many of other races receiving some sort of Income Assistance, and still the biggest welfare bums in the country is still the corporate sector, because they feel no sense of obligation to the poor and starving in this country or in the third world where they have moved many of our jobs to. Yet they continue to demand lower taxes on the properties they still own here in Canada.

I think a step in the right direction would be the burning of bot the FTA, and NAFTA, along with any other trade agreements they have signed or are about to sign, and instead put tariffs on all products entering from third world countries, and just sit back and watch a bunch of corporate bums do a meltdown they will be so upset.

As Canadian's we are stupid. Instead of checking out the labels on clothing and other manufactured goods and placing them back onto the shelf if they are not manufactured in Canada, we are picking them up and going to checkout withour a thought to the fact that the manufacturer's label for that product once stated, "Made in Canada."

[Sully]

Well the thing is the world today is not anything like what it used to be. Namely even the smallest business in the world can feel competition from all corners of the globe. The world is connected as one, a "global village" and therefore countries have to compete to keep WEALTHY CITIZENS and WEALTHY CORPORATIONS PAYING TAXES WITHIN THEIR BORDERS. By being wealthy in both cases, there are many more choices awarded to you (as in many cases there should be for your hard work or special talents, capitalism tends to rewards those as it should) that obviously people without wealth cannot have, c'est la vie, but this is nothing new as history has shown.

With perfect capital mobility citizens and corporations can move freely to wherever they feel the situation is most beneficial to them. A country has to decide the trade offs between a citizen/corporation leaving and giving into their demands.

If a corporation leaves, then Canada loses:

1.) Jobs of the people who worked for the company (oh no the governing party in power loses votes from those people) #s could be in 000s

2.) People now in many cases on EI or welfare, drains the system

3.) Less people are paying income taxes into the Canadian system and a corporation has now left the system and pays no taxes at all

CANADA LOSES : CORPORATE TAXES + LOSS OF INCOME TAX + INCREASED DRAIN ON SOCIAL SYSTEM + MUNICIPAL PROPERTY TAXES LOSS etc..........

The effect ripples down through the system

Corporations do not owe anything to society by just existing, governments reasonably should keep them in line (environmentally, socially), be nice if profitable companies gave back on their own accord, but why should they when the govt. will squander their tax dollars.

Many effects happen with wealthy citizens who feel they are taxed too much and leave:

1.) Less investment in Canada, means less capital to build factories, less money for research etc.... think of construction jobs to build those the factories, smart people staying here (scientists) WHY WOULD THEY ? No increase in employment opportunities here, but there will be wherever the money goes.

2.) Less income tax being paid into system and they are huge dollars too

I mean if you think that not reducing taxes would outweigh these losses, then you do not give into them, but as you can see this is just a brief description of why govts would do so, if you have alternative solutions then bring them forward and run for office, then we will see if those ideas work in reality.

[err]

err:

The overly simplistic "right wing" answers distort the issues to be a "hand-out to those who refuse to work" type attitude.... the straw-man argument.

Gotcha.

Rightwingers are just too goshdarned stupid and simple to understand that leftwing "nuance".

Some right-wingers are wealthy and don't want anyone else to get a slice of their pie, and a large percentage of the rest are "goshdarned stupid". It would appear from your posts that you fit into the latter category....

[err]

If a corporation leaves, then Canada loses:

1.) Jobs of the people who worked for the company (oh no the governing party in power loses votes from those people) #s could be in 000s

2.) People now in many cases on EI or welfare, drains the system

3.) Less people are paying income taxes into the Canadian system and a corporation has now left the system and pays no taxes at all

In many cases you may have points... but, for example, if WalMart were to leave, it could be a positive thing....

- Less businesses bankrupt by their bottom basement pricing

- Businesses who used to pay their employees much better than WalMart does

- Shutdown of CANADIAN businesses, whose money stayed in the local economy

Resulting in less money staying in our Canadian economy...

CANADA LOSES : CORPORATE TAXES + LOSS OF INCOME TAX + INCREASED DRAIN ON SOCIAL SYSTEM + MUNICIPAL PROPERTY TAXES LOSS etc..........

Corporations do not owe anything to society by just existing, governments reasonably should keep them in line (environmentally, socially), be nice if profitable companies gave back on their own accord, but why should they when the govt. will squander their tax dollars.

How about helping to pay for the infrastructure that makes their business possible. Contributing to the health care for their employees, as companies in the USA, competing for talented employees have to .... If they don't contribute to the system then they are parasites of it...

Many effects happen with wealthy citizens who feel they are taxed too much and leave:

1.) Less investment in Canada, means less capital to build factories, less money for research etc.... think of construction jobs to build those the factories, smart people staying here (scientists) WHY WOULD THEY ? No increase in employment opportunities here, but there will be wherever the money goes.

and pray tell, where are they going to move to... In the USA, businesses pay more tax than businesses in have to pay in Canada.... As mentioned above, aside from higher paid high-tech jobs in the USA, companies often have to swallow large health care premiums to attract employees.... Here in Canada, business has it good.....

2.) Less income tax being paid into system and they are huge dollars too

I mean if you think that not reducing taxes would outweigh these losses, then you do not give into them, but as you can see this is just a brief description of why govts would do so, if you have alternative solutions then bring them forward and run for office, then we will see if those ideas work in reality.

Maybe you should run with your platform of trying to be the Walmart of tax collection.... Don't collect very much, and drop all social services to allow it to be economically feasible... When the country becomes run-down enough, people will work for nearly nothing to pay for food... Indonesia North... with sweat shops everywhere... then maybe we could under-cut the Chinese and export to them... Maybe you should run on that platform to turn Canada into a major exporter....

[Montgomery Burns]

err:

The overly simplistic "right wing" answers distort the issues to be a "hand-out to those who refuse to work" type attitude.... the straw-man argument.

Gotcha.

Rightwingers are just too goshdarned stupid and simple to understand that leftwing "nuance".

Some right-wingers are wealthy and don't want anyone else to get a slice of their pie, and a large percentage of the rest are "goshdarned stupid". It would appear from your posts that you fit into the latter category....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not taking your bait. I'm not going to reply to your insults. The administrator has asked me to ignore the constant insults I receive from the far left on this forum; rise above the trolls.

But tell me one thing. Why shouldn't I (who am comfortable, but hardly wealthy) want anyone to get a slice of the pie that I worked my fingers to the bone to receive? The first year I started my business, I worked a good 70 hrs/wk. Why should I give my hard-earned dollars to the drunk Indians who constantly try to shake me down for money when I go downtown? Why do you want to penalize me for busting my butt - and taking a financial risk - to create a good company that provides a good service with fair prices, and hires employees (how I wish I was a Crown Corporation that had no competition)?

As that old song goes: Get a J-O-B. Na na na na na na na.

I prefer to offer charity of my own accord. I dislike being forced to give up the money I worked hard for.

I'm tired of paying for the socialist sh*t-sucking anal leeches. :angry:

[Sully]

In many cases you may have points... but, for example, if WalMart were to leave, it could be a positive thing....

- Less businesses bankrupt by their bottom basement pricing

- Businesses who used to pay their employees much better than WalMart does

- Shutdown of CANADIAN businesses, whose money stayed in the local economy

Resulting in less money staying in our Canadian economy...

CANADA LOSES : CORPORATE TAXES + LOSS OF INCOME TAX + INCREASED DRAIN ON SOCIAL SYSTEM + MUNICIPAL PROPERTY TAXES LOSS etc..........

As a consumer I am all for paying as little as I can for products that I buy, if that means shopping at Wal-Mart so be it. I am not concerned about who USED TO DO THIS AND USED TO DO THAT I live in the contemporary world. I myself, had jobs that I worked hard at and that paid me squat, wanna know what I did : DUM DA DA DUM I LEFT that job. I used that crappy job to pay for my University Degree (YAY ME, PAT ON THE BACK) to get a better one in the future, see I realize nothing will get handed to me. Thankfully my family with a strong work ethic has a greater influence on me than people with your line of thinking (ie the hand being held out, bet those shoulders are mighty developed on you). You know what, if Canadian companies shutdown and cannot compete, TOO BAD, I would like Canadian companies to do good, but its not a real concern to me.

Also Err, while your shopping at Wal Mart can you pick me up a pair of wire cutters, there is a great deal on them right now?????

How about helping to pay for the infrastructure that makes their business possible. Contributing to the health care for their employees, as companies in the USA, competing for talented employees have to .... If they don't contribute to the system then they are parasites of it...

Umm well hmmm geez, I am trying to get this to your level of thinking here err. Oh I got it, its called taxes, silly me you already know this. Here is how it works

Consumer buys a good ---> Leads to income of firm ---> Firm payes taxes on that income to Govt. and Dum da da Dum GOVERNMENT HOPEFULLY PUTS MONEY INTO PROPER INFRASTRUCTURE that benefits Canadian Society. You see government are the ones that really are to be held accountable here and also I have seen many companies voluntarily put up parks, structures and sewage lines yada yada at their own cost, so they too add to INFRASTRUCTURE, maybe just not the way you want it done.

Now to tackle the other really simple issue of HEALTH CARE, I am thinking you mean that a company which offers benefits to their employees. You already answered it, companies will offer this BENEFIT for TALENTED EMPLOYEES.

So there are two parts to this here in Canada

1.) A company sees your talents as being beneficial enough to offer you an EXTENEDED benefit package, thats great you probably deserve it and its totally optional and an expense of the company, good thing they reward people that are valuable to them

2.) NO ONE in Canada will be denied necessary medical services (THERE WILL BE THE EXCEPTION TO THE RULE, WE WILL SEE THAT ON THE NIGHTLY NEWS)

So once again companies through taxes pay the government, who then take care of Health Care Infrastructure, blame the government if you have an issue with that. A final note, how about employees who do not contribute to the success of the company, do I dare call them PARASITES.

and pray tell, where are they going to move to... In the USA, businesses pay more tax than businesses in have to pay in Canada.... As mentioned above, aside from higher paid high-tech jobs in the USA, companies often have to swallow large health care premiums to attract employees.... Here in Canada, business has it good.....

Well actually a business will move to where THE BUSINESS finds it most beneficial, could be anywhere, depends on which jurisdiction offers the best incentives to move there. Never ever said business had it bad here in Canada, some thrive while others fail for a multitude of different reasons.

Maybe you should run with your platform of trying to be the Walmart of tax collection.... Don't collect very much, and drop all social services to allow it to be economically feasible... When the country becomes run-down enough, people will work for nearly nothing to pay for food... Indonesia North... with sweat shops everywhere... then maybe we could under-cut the Chinese and export to them... Maybe you should run on that platform to turn Canada into a major exporter....

Well ya since I am heir to the Walton fortune might be a good idea eh??? When you come back from the fringes of quoting every extreme situation that you read about in the paper we could probably have a better debate.

Well I d like to say I would hire you when that day comes but I ll be honest the company would be unable to afford your services, but maybe you can go to the States and get all those benefits they give to talented folk such as yourself.....

[err]

Why should I give my hard-earned dollars to the drunk Indians who constantly try to shake me down for money when I go downtown?  Why do you want to penalize me for busting my butt - and taking a financial risk - to create a good company that provides a good service with fair prices, and hires employees (how I wish I was a Crown Corporation that had no competition)?

I prefer to offer charity of my own accord.  I dislike being forced to give up the money I worked hard for.

I'm tired of paying for the socialist sh*t-sucking anal leeches.    :angry:

Is that how you spell REDNECK ???

I'm surprised you forgot to mention about the "commies" who want to take money from the rich to help the poor ...

And we've seen the part about wanting the "choice" not to help people before... Usually it appears to be the right-wingers who want the "choice not to help", and we all know what that means...

[err]

As a consumer I am all for paying as little as I can for products that I  buy, if that means shopping at Wal-Mart so be it. I am not concerned about who USED TO DO THIS AND USED TO DO THAT I live in the contemporary world. I myself, had jobs that I worked hard at and that paid me squat, wanna know what I did :  DUM DA DA DUM I LEFT that job.

Tunnel vision... That's great. If you don't think about all the people you're doing out of jobs, Canadian businesses being bankrupted by WalMart, then just keep thinking about yourself only, and save that few dollars. However, your taxes might go up a bit to pay for the additional loss of revenue to Canada due to your self centredness, but... look after number one...

I used that crappy job to pay for my University Degree (YAY ME, PAT ON THE BACK) to get a better one in the future, see I realize nothing will get handed to me. Thankfully my family with a strong work ethic has a greater influence on me than people with your line of thinking (ie the hand being held out, bet those shoulders are mighty developed on you). You know what, if Canadian companies shutdown and cannot compete, TOO BAD, I would like Canadian companies to do good, but its not a real concern to me.

... that's right.. you shop at Walmart...

Also Err, while your shopping at Wal Mart can you pick me up a pair of wire cutters, there is a great deal on them right now?????

I don't shop there. Sorry, I have a conscience...

How about helping to pay for the infrastructure that makes their business possible.  Contributing to the health care for their employees, as companies in the USA, competing for talented employees have to .... If they don't contribute to the system then they are parasites of it...

Umm well hmmm geez, I am trying to get this to your level of thinking here err. Oh I got it, its called taxes, silly me you already know this. Here is how it works

Consumer buys a good ---> Leads to income of firm ---> Firm payes taxes on that income to Govt. and Dum da da Dum GOVERNMENT HOPEFULLY PUTS MONEY INTO PROPER INFRASTRUCTURE that benefits Canadian Society. You see government are the ones that really are to be held accountable here...

Taxes... the payment for infrastructure that allows the companies to survive... Now that you've demonstrated that you have a basic understanding of that concept, I have to question your level of comprehension... You are pushing for "less taxes". Is that balanced with a desire for "less infrastructure", or do you want to take more away from the poor so that these companies can pay "less taxes".

Now to tackle the other really simple issue of HEALTH CARE, I am thinking you mean that a company  which offers benefits to their employees. You already answered it, companies will offer this BENEFIT for TALENTED EMPLOYEES.

So there are two parts to this here in Canada

1.) A company sees your talents as being beneficial enough to offer you an EXTENEDED benefit package, thats great you probably deserve it and its totally optional and an expense of the company, good thing they reward people that are valuable to them

Why not just have the company pay its Canadian taxes, and sustain our health care system. It's actually cheaper for the companies that hire "talented people". It's companies like Walmart that would benefit from reductions in taxes and a corresponding reduction in health care...

and pray tell, where are they going to move to... In the USA, businesses pay more tax than businesses in have to pay in Canada....  As mentioned above, aside from higher paid high-tech jobs in the USA, companies often have to swallow large health care premiums to attract employees....  Here in Canada, business has it good....

Well actually a business will move to where THE BUSINESS finds it most beneficial, could be anywhere, depends on which jurisdiction offers the best incentives to move there. Never ever said business had it bad here in Canada, some thrive while others fail for a multitude of different reasons.

Never said business had it bad in Canada... So what's the point of your post... You were saying taxes should be reduced... to what end... to what level.... to compete with whom.....

[Sully]

As a consumer I am all for paying as little as I can for products that I  buy........

Tunnel vision... That's great. If you don't think about all the people you're doing out of jobs, Canadian businesses being bankrupted by WalMart, then just keep thinking about yourself only, and save that few dollars. However, your taxes might go up a bit to pay for the additional loss of revenue to Canada due to your self centredness, but... look after number one...

Yes I only wish one day to have that all encompassing vision that you possess, which allows everyone of my actions in my life to be completely moral and just. Let me ask you, do you have the most economical car that you can afford, if not why?? Think about the children in the future!!!! Can you say for 100% certainty that every article of clothing you are wearing, was not made in a sweat shop, if not why?? Think about the children who were taken advantage of to make that clothing you now wear. Funny thing is I think you are all talk, with not a lot to back it up. Just like you I cannot worry about how everyone my actions affects the world around me and like I said before if you are unable to live in today's reality, too bad its not a concern to me. However I would like my fellow Canadians to be successful, but they have to do it on their own and not with govt. handouts. HEY ERR NOBODY MOVES NOBODY GETS HURT...

I used that crappy job to pay for my University Degree (YAY ME, PAT ON THE BACK) ......

... that's right.. you shop at Walmart...

I do now and then, so whats your point.....

Also Err, while your shopping at Wal Mart can you pick me up a pair of wire cutters, there is a great deal on them right now?????

I don't shop there. Sorry, I have a conscience...

Wow, you are truly a man/woman of the people.....thats terrific!!!!

How about helping to pay for the infrastructure that makes their business possible.  Contributing to the health care for their employees, as companies in the USA, competing for talented employees have to .... If they don't contribute to the system then they are parasites of it...

Taxes... the payment for infrastructure that allows the companies to survive... Now that you've demonstrated that you have a basic understanding of that concept, I have to question your level of comprehension... You are pushing for "less taxes". Is that balanced with a desire for "less infrastructure", or do you want to take more away from the poor so that these companies can pay "less taxes".

Well I will try explain this to you yet again, its the tradeoff between all the losses that would be incurred as a result of the large business leaving CANADIAN TAX JURISDICTION (CORPORATE TAXES)+LOSS OF JOBS+LOSS OF INCOME TAXES PAID INTO SYSTEM+etc... VS..... the loss in tax revenue as a result of the tax cut.

Now its clearly outlined, I will leave it up to figure it out from here on.....one thing that cracks me up about you is that anytime there is a focus on corporations or wealthy people, you instantly relate that to an attack on poor, talk about brainwashing, here we go again to explain how the corporations relate to poor people

OVER HERE IS(CORPORATION)---IN BETWEEN IS(GOVT)-----OVER HERE IS(POOR)

DO YOU SEE THAT GOVERNMENT IS THE BUFFER THERE BETWEEN THE TWO AND HOW TAXES WOULD FLOW THROUGH, NOW BY HAVING TAXES HIGH THAT COULD POTENTIALLY ELIMINATE THE CORPORATION OUT OF THE EQUATION.

Now tell me err(or), would it be better with no taxes at all, where would the money come from to support your po po people!!!!

Now to tackle the other really simple issue of HEALTH CARE, I am thinking you mean that a company  which offers benefits to their employees. You already answered it, companies will offer this BENEFIT for TALENTED EMPLOYEES.......

Why not just have the company pay its Canadian taxes, and sustain our health care system. It's actually cheaper for the companies that hire "talented people". It's companies like Walmart that would benefit from reductions in taxes and a corresponding reduction in health care...

Well err, where do you get this stuff from, CANADIAN COMPANIES DO PAY CANADIAN TAXES, where once again the govt will earmark those TAXES for HEALTH CARE. Yes you hate Walmart we know....well not everyone at Wal Mart is talented, don't you get this, not everyone on the earth is worth 6 figure salaries. Tell you what if Wal Mart ever has to close a store down, they should hire you, with your policies that would put forward they would have that particular store out of business quicker than they ever thought possible.

Well actually a business will move to where THE BUSINESS finds it most beneficial, could be anywhere, depends on which jurisdiction offers the best incentives......

Never said business had it bad in Canada... So what's the point of your post... You were saying taxes should be reduced... to what end... to what level.... to compete with whom.....

Well err point out to me where I said I THINK CANADA SHOULD LOWER TAXES, please do, if you find it, please show me where. I stated reasons why a government would want to lower taxes, in order to be competitive against other jurisdictions who would try lure them away......

Man I just do not get it, you come on here , you might read one sentence and then you get so excited to reply with all your babble......very sad. Actually read what we reply to you and you get the answers you ask for......

[Sully]

Sorry guys for not posting replies in the proper fashion, someone please direct me to where I can find this out, used to be a lot easier. Thanks

[Renegade]

As a consumer I am all for paying as little as I can for products that I  buy........

Tunnel vision... That's great. If you don't think about all the people you're doing out of jobs, Canadian businesses being bankrupted by WalMart, then just keep thinking about yourself only, and save that few dollars. However, your taxes might go up a bit to pay for the additional loss of revenue to Canada due to your self centredness, but... look after number one...

Yes I only wish one day to have that all encompassing vision that you possess, which allows everyone of my actions in my life to be completely moral and just. Let me ask you, do you have the most economical car that you can afford, if not why?? Think about the children in the future!!!! Can you say for 100% certainty that every article of clothing you are wearing, was not made in a sweat shop, if not why?? Think about the children who were taken advantage of to make that clothing you now wear. Funny thing is I think you are all talk, with not a lot to back it up. Just like you I cannot worry about how everyone my actions affects the world around me and like I said before if you are unable to live in today's reality, too bad its not a concern to me. However I would like my fellow Canadians to be successful, but they have to do it on their own and not with govt. handouts. HEY ERR NOBODY MOVES NOBODY GETS HURT...

I used that crappy job to pay for my University Degree (YAY ME, PAT ON THE BACK) ......

... that's right.. you shop at Walmart...

I do now and then, so whats your point.....

Also Err, while your shopping at Wal Mart can you pick me up a pair of wire cutters, there is a great deal on them right now?????

I don't shop there. Sorry, I have a conscience...

Wow, you are truly a man/woman of the people.....thats terrific!!!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Renegade]

How about helping to pay for the infrastructure that makes their business possible.  Contributing to the health care for their employees, as companies in the USA, competing for talented employees have to .... If they don't contribute to the system then they are parasites of it...

Taxes... the payment for infrastructure that allows the companies to survive... Now that you've demonstrated that you have a basic understanding of that concept, I have to question your level of comprehension... You are pushing for "less taxes". Is that balanced with a desire for "less infrastructure", or do you want to take more away from the poor so that these companies can pay "less taxes".

Well I will try explain this to you yet again, its the tradeoff between all the losses that would be incurred as a result of the large business leaving CANADIAN TAX JURISDICTION (CORPORATE TAXES)+LOSS OF JOBS+LOSS OF INCOME TAXES PAID INTO SYSTEM+etc... VS..... the loss in tax revenue as a result of the tax cut.

Now its clearly outlined, I will leave it up to figure it out from here on.....one thing that cracks me up about you is that anytime there is a focus on corporations or wealthy people, you instantly relate that to an attack on poor, talk about brainwashing, here we go again to explain how the corporations relate to poor people

OVER HERE IS(CORPORATION)---IN BETWEEN IS(GOVT)-----OVER HERE IS(POOR)

DO YOU SEE THAT GOVERNMENT IS THE BUFFER THERE BETWEEN THE TWO AND HOW TAXES WOULD FLOW THROUGH, NOW BY HAVING TAXES HIGH THAT COULD POTENTIALLY ELIMINATE THE CORPORATION OUT OF THE EQUATION.

Now tell me err(or), would it be better with no taxes at all, where would the money come from to support your po po people!!!!

Now to tackle the other really simple issue of HEALTH CARE, I am thinking you mean that a company  which offers benefits to their employees. You already answered it, companies will offer this BENEFIT for TALENTED EMPLOYEES.......

Why not just have the company pay its Canadian taxes, and sustain our health care system. It's actually cheaper for the companies that hire "talented people". It's companies like Walmart that would benefit from reductions in taxes and a corresponding reduction in health care...

Well err, where do you get this stuff from, CANADIAN COMPANIES DO PAY CANADIAN TAXES, where once again the govt will earmark those TAXES for HEALTH CARE. Yes you hate Walmart we know....well not everyone at Wal Mart is talented, don't you get this, not everyone on the earth is worth 6 figure salaries. Tell you what if Wal Mart ever has to close a store down, they should hire you, with your policies that would put forward they would have that particular store out of business quicker than they ever thought possible.

Well actually a business will move to where THE BUSINESS finds it most beneficial, could be anywhere, depends on which jurisdiction offers the best incentives......

Never said business had it bad in Canada... So what's the point of your post... You were saying taxes should be reduced... to what end... to what level.... to compete with whom.....

Well err point out to me where I said I THINK CANADA SHOULD LOWER TAXES, please do, if you find it, please show me where. I stated reasons why a government would want to lower taxes, in order to be competitive against other jurisdictions who would try lure them away......

Man I just do not get it, you come on here , you might read one sentence and then you get so excited to reply with all your babble......very sad. Actually read what we reply to you and you get the answers you ask for......

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[theloniusfleabag]

Dear Sully,

Sorry guys for not posting replies in the proper fashion, someone please direct me to where I can find this out, used to be a lot easier. Thanks

With the new format that came online several months ago, you can not use more that 10 quotes per post, or they get all retarded...er..'differently abled'.

[Argus]

And we've seen the part about wanting the "choice" not to help people before... Usually it appears to be the right-wingers who want the "choice not to help", and we all know what that means...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They're the ones actually paying taxes?

[Argus]

I don't know if you can appreciate it, but Paul Martin is a fiscal Conservative... There's not question about it....  That makes him "right wing" in my opinion...

Anyone left of Fidel Castro is right wing to you.

Taking money from the poor to fund corporate tax cuts...

How do you take money from the poor when they pay no taxes? What you are referring to is perhaps not giving a given amount of money to "the poor" which you believe they are somehow entitled to for some reason.

Corporations are non-persons. If they pay a billion dollars in their profits as taxes, that is a billion less to give to stockholders. That might mean stockholders will invest somewhere else, like outside of Canada, instead of this one (which most people do anyway). On the other hand, if you leave that billion with the company, it either has to invest it in further production in Canada, or give it to its stockholders, who should then be taxed.

Naturally, there remains the problem of foreign ownership. That is, frankly, the only reason I can think of to tax corporations. Well, aside from our lousy tax system which doesn't tax people properly.

[Guest eureka]

Worry less about the proper fashion and more about your "logic." Do a little less personalizng and you might het closer to an understanding. You obviously have not clued in to anything err has sais. You acnnot, for instance, relate to the fact that Canadian Corporate taxes are low and business is not being driven away by them.

In fact, costs of doing business in Canada are amongst the lowest in the developed world.

You also do not seem to appreciate what infrastructure is - in the case of WalMart. Really, you do not seem to appreciate (understand may be a word you understand better) any of err's points about WalMart.

Wow, man, in your parlance, do you not understand that businesses are not leaving Canada because of taxes. Therefore, Thre is no los of revenue to be factored into your equation.

err may "crack you up," but your ideas are crackpot anyway so there should be no conflict between your newly bigger cracks and the old.

[Sully]

K, here you go Eureka, provide to me a link that proves that the cost of doing business in Canada is among lowest in the developed world , please make the source unbiased but you and I both know you will not......

Secondly just like Err you have a selective reading disability as well as a lil creativity. NO WHERE DID I SAY THAT CANADA'S TAXATION POLICY IS DRIVING AWAY BUSINESSES FROM CANADA. Go ahead read back and try to find it. I have only stated why Canada might want to lower taxes for corporations and how other jurisdictions provide incentives to lure companies AWAY from Canada.....

Hey I can appreciate the points of Wal Mart (actually I am just saying that for you to feel better),but I can appreciate its success due to the fact that millions and millions of consumers make it one of the largest corporations in the world, because that company provides what those people are looking for at a great price, its a great concept eh......

Ummmm Eureka please read what I actually write before posting, actually reply against what I have stated not something you made up. Much appreciated.....

[theloniusfleabag]

Dear Sully,

but I can appreciate its success due to the fact that millions and millions of consumers make it one of the largest corporations in the world, because that company provides what those people are looking for at a great price, its a great concept eh......

Krusty the Klown (from the Simpsons) evidently had a great line in a show that Wal-Mart could well use in their 'Toy & T-Shirt' promos..."Made for children...by children! We pass the 'slavings' on to you!"<wink wink>" Most people abhor slave labour and 'sweatshops', but it doesn't stop them from finding a 'good deal'.