DogOnPorch Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 40 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said: No, I said they attacked the neighbourhood he was living in. A group of armed men attacked the village and killed every one there except one kid who was badly wounded. As they approached him, presumably to finish him off (he would be justified in believing) he defended himself and managed to kill one of the men who he believed were going to kill him. If he were a Canadian kid living in Israel and the attackers were Palestinians, would you still call him a terrorist? If these Palestinians then tortured him and the Canadian Government collaborated with the Palestinians in the torture, don't you think he should receive compensation? Omar went to Afghanistan to conduct Jihad. He specifically asked not to be left at home with the women. These folks shot first and killed the translators dead in the first volley. The Americans then opened fire. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 He was a child doing what his idiot father told him when they went to the Middle East. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 If this happened to an Israeli settlement in the occupied West Bank and the settlers opened fire on a unit of armed Palestinians coming to attack them, would you see it the same way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 The Muslims I know are well-integrated. A better topic might be 'what do we do about Canada'? We need to re-platform our public discussion so that we address legit concerns and marginalize and shut down trolls. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: The Muslims I know are well-integrated. A better topic might be 'what do we do about Canada'? Most Canadians I know are well integrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 49 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said: He was a child doing what his idiot father told him when they went to the Middle East. No...he specifically asked to go to Afghanistan so as to not be left behind with the women. And he went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 29 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: The Muslims I know are well-integrated. A better topic might be 'what do we do about Canada'? We need to re-platform our public discussion so that we address legit concerns and marginalize and shut down trolls. That's right...blame Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 43 minutes ago, bcsapper said: Most Canadians I know are well integrated. They're not, though. There's so much disunity right now and no basis for building consensus or solutions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 10 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: They're not, though. There's so much disunity right now and no basis for building consensus or solutions. On pipelines, maybe. I don't see a lot otherwise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Michael Hardner said: The Muslims I know are well-integrated. A better topic might be 'what do we do about Canada'? We need to re-platform our public discussion so that we address legit concerns and marginalize and shut down trolls. How many of the million Muslims in Canada do you know? How many of those who are NOT integrated are you likely to meet given they generally lack the skillset to work in your industry or to live in the same neighborhood? You cannot decide that because you know some Muslims who are integrated this is not a legitimate concern. Besides, how well do you even know them? Do you know their innermost thoughts? Their social values and beliefs? What they saw among their fellow Muslims at the mosque? Edited January 1, 2019 by Argus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 Just now, Argus said: How many of the million Muslims in Canada do you know? How many of those who are NOT integrated are you likely to meet given they generally lack the skillset to work in your industry or to live in the same neighborhood? I don't claim to know a representative number. I just think that it's difficult if not impossible to come up with a way to assess a group as a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 2 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said: No, I said they attacked the neighbourhood he was living in. A group of armed men attacked the village and killed every one ther Omar was there in a foreign country with his father to wage war against the enemies of Allah. He had been trained in how to make bombs and use firearms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, bcsapper said: On pipelines, maybe. I don't see a lot otherwise? There's no unity on many issues, and furthermore stupid ideas like UN conspiracies are infecting politics and especially Conservative parties. The NDP will ground itself by trying to win elections based on identity politics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 2 hours ago, Queenmandy85 said: I'll give you that. How many Canadians have been killed by muslim terrorists and how many have been killed by sikhs? The worst terrorist attack in Canadian history was perpetrated by Sikh fundamentalists. Why do we not fear Sikhs? Because, just like Muslims, the violence is perpetrated by a few idiots. The Catholic Church did not condone the attacks on Protestants in Ulster, the greater Islamic community condemns violence by extremists, as does the Sikh, Jewish and Buddhist community. More Canadians have been killed by Muslim terrorists than by any other kind of terrorism. And they are subjected to a near daily litany of world news where Muslims slaughter Scandinavian girls in one country, blow up a bus in another, stab people on the subway in another, run people over in another, blow up a church in another. Clearly that's going to have a substantial impact on how they see Muslims. Sikhs, like Armenians, had one incident decades in the past. Not the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 2 hours ago, Kerfuffle said: The better question is what do we do about religion. It is protected by the Charter. Thus the question can only be "What do we do about the harsh religious views and values of people who want to come here and become citizens." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 1 minute ago, Michael Hardner said: There's no unity on many issues, and furthermore stupid ideas like UN conspiracies are infecting politics and especially Conservative parties. The NDP will ground itself by trying to win elections based on identity politics. Normal everyday disunity, perhaps. But that's the kind of thing one gets all the time in countries where one is allowed to freely express ideas and opinions. The pipleline/energy issue is the only one I can see doing damage right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 1 hour ago, Queenmandy85 said: He was a child doing what his idiot father told him when they went to the Middle East. I recognize we infantalize young men here, but 15 is more than old enough to know what you're doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 20 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: They're not, though. There's so much disunity right now and no basis for building consensus or solutions. Everything has become political that didn't used to be and which should not be. Immigration should not be a political topic, nor pipelines nor climate change. People seize on a position and embrace it as if it were a religious artifact they must protect at all costs. I'm willing to compromise on all these things but I see little interest in compromise from the other side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 1, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said: I don't claim to know a representative number. I just think that it's difficult if not impossible to come up with a way to assess a group as a problem. Would you agree with me that the principal reason behind the rising sense of anti-immigration from Canadians is fear of Muslims and what they represent? BTW, my experience with Muslims is rather different. I lived in the riding which has the highest number of Muslims in Canada, in a building which was 50% made up of Somalians and Lebanese. The level of integration was minimal. Edited January 1, 2019 by Argus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 1, 2019 Report Share Posted January 1, 2019 4 hours ago, Kerfuffle said: The better question is what do we do about religion. Make it a "Charter Right"....then fight about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted January 2, 2019 Report Share Posted January 2, 2019 4 hours ago, Argus said: Sikhs, like Armenians, had one incident decades in the past. Not the same thing. 268 Canadians died in the Air India bombing, the attack on Ujjal Dosanjh, the assassination of Tara Singh Hayer, the attempted murder of an Indian diplomat in BC. to name the more prominent attacks. Yet, the Sikh community is a welcome part of the Canadian people. The same should be said of our Muslim brothers and sisters. I would be willing to bet most murders committed in Canada are committed by non-Muslims and non-Sikhs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted January 2, 2019 Report Share Posted January 2, 2019 7 hours ago, DogOnPorch said: 7 hours ago, DogOnPorch said: Omar went to Afghanistan to conduct Jihad. He specifically asked not to be left at home with the women. These folks shot first and killed the translators dead in the first volley. The Americans then opened fire. Previous to that he was building bombs with which to better kill the infidel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 2, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2019 10 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said: 268 Canadians died in the Air India bombing, the attack on Ujjal Dosanjh, the assassination of Tara Singh Hayer, the attempted murder of an Indian diplomat in BC. to name the more prominent attacks. Yet, the Sikh community is a welcome part of the Canadian people There is reason to be doubtful of the Sikh community in my mind, and I've said so. There is still too strong an attachment to the idea of separatism and too much support for violent terrorists in India. Nevertheless, overall there have been no attacks on "Canadians" meaning they've kept the violence within the Indo-Canadian community, and all in the past. Sikh terrorism in India has pretty much ended, as well. Muslim terrorism is a daily event across the world, and it's indicative of a rigid, intolerant view of life, of non-believers, women, Jews and gays which runs counter to Canadian ideals. Thus the idea of importing tens of thousands of such people each year, mostly from the most fanatic-prone parts of the world, is angering a lot of Canadians, and turning them against immigration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queenmandy85 Posted January 2, 2019 Report Share Posted January 2, 2019 6 minutes ago, Argus said: Muslim terrorism is a daily event across the world, and it's indicative of a rigid, intolerant view of life The same can be said of the current Buddihist terrorism against Muslims. My question is why do people single out Muslims? 8 minutes ago, Argus said: Nevertheless, overall there have been no attacks on "Canadians" I just cited the murder of 268 Canadians on Air India and the attack on (later)Premier Dosanjh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted January 2, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2019 6 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said: The same can be said of the current Buddihist terrorism against Muslims. My question is why do people single out Muslims? Uhm, because when was the last time a Buddhist attacked the West, attacked Canada? Buddhists are seen as peaceful, overall, and not intolerant like Muslims. Certainly Muslim countries are all, without exception, intolerant, with none of them treating women as the equals of men, nor unbelievers as the equals of Muslims. We've had a number of terrorist incidents and attempted terrorist incidents in Canada, and none were by Buddhists. 6 minutes ago, Queenmandy85 said: I just cited the murder of 268 Canadians on Air India and the attack on (later)Premier Dosanjh. Well, sorry to point it out, but that was seen as Indians attacking Indians because of Indian politics. And as I said, overall Sikhs and their values are considered to be less hostile to Canadian values, and they are considered to be more likely to integrate. AFAIK anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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