Rohingya Issue

[betsy]

On 10/20/2017 at 12:50 PM, marcus said:

Exactly. Why would hundreds of thousands of people suddenly just leave? Is it to create a fake story? 

Once again, Betsy is here to push the impossible angle to a story. Why? Because Muslims can never be the victim. They are the evils. Our war should be against Muslims. That's the path that has been drawn for her by the fundamentalists in order to reach the fictitious story of the rapture.

Betsy is trying to excuse genocide and murder. People like Betsy are no different than those who try to excuse, downplay or deny ISIS' genocidal behaviour. 

 

People like you are the reason why we see so much violence now. 

You don't want anyone to express an opinion that you don't like, even when you obviously don't even understand the rationale behind it. 

So....here's my advise to the bully:

 

Nothing wrong with knee-jerk reaction, but don't spout off stupid things.  Keep your emotions in check, and your wits about you.

 

And, when you're in a discussion board, don't make it personal.  Don't go low down to character assassination.  Don't be bitchy.  Discuss like a mature adult.

Edited October 23, 2017 by betsy

[SpankyMcFarland]

2 hours ago, betsy said:

  I think they all belong in the same race.  It could be a religious feud, though.

No, they don't belong to the same race. The people being driven out are South Asian like Indians and the people driving them out are Oriental like Indonesians etc. Look at the pictures.

Edited October 23, 2017 by SpankyMcFarland

[betsy]

1 hour ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

No, they don't belong to the same race. The people being driven out are South Asian like Indians and the people driving them out are Oriental like Indonesians etc. Look at the pictures.

 

I think you're right.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rohingya_people

 

[GostHacked]

NO worries, the USA and others will provide help by bombing the nation into oblivion and will turn into failed states like Afghanistan, Iraq and others.

But these are Muslims, who here really cares? 

[hot enough]

On 10/1/2017 at 2:21 PM, -TSS- said:

The EU and the UN support an independent Palestine state but both are against independent Kurdistan or Catalonia. Such double standards.

You might have a point if Israel had not, was not to this day, stealing Palestinian lands.

[marcus]

On 10/23/2017 at 3:41 AM, betsy said:

And, when you're in a discussion board, don't make it personal.  Don't go low down to character assassination.  Don't be bitchy.  Discuss like a mature adult.

Interesting. Your comment comes right after making this comment:

People like you are the reason why we see so much violence now. 

Daft.

If Muslims are victims, right away, there must be a conspiracy theory, right?

Betsy, your comments, your links and responses on this forum cement stereotypes. You are trying to sell a conspiracy theory in regards to the fleeing 400K people. Ridiculous.

My recommendation is to put your perverted interpretation of the bible down, stop segregating and begin to love "all" people. This is what Jesus would want. 

[Guest]

On 10/23/2017 at 9:23 AM, GostHacked said:

NO worries, the USA and others will provide help by bombing the nation into oblivion and will turn into failed states like Afghanistan, Iraq and others.

But these are Muslims, who here really cares? 

Presuming innocence, as I am wont to do, I assume they are good Muslims, not bad ones.  So I care.

Which nation is that again?  Are we still talking about Burma?

[betsy]

13 hours ago, marcus said:

Interesting. Your comment comes right after making this comment:

People like you are the reason why we see so much violence now. 

Daft.

If Muslims are victims, right away, there must be a conspiracy theory, right?

Betsy, your comments, your links and responses on this forum cement stereotypes. You are trying to sell a conspiracy theory in regards to the fleeing 400K people. Ridiculous.

My recommendation is to put your perverted interpretation of the bible down, stop segregating and begin to love "all" people. This is what Jesus would want. 

Your opinion is based on your inability to understand what was said in the OP......or, you're simply being malicious in pinning a label on people whose opinions didn't meet your approval.

My OP says:

I don't know what to make of the claim of ethnic cleansing being done to Rohingya Muslims.  

Forgive me if I sound cynical or skeptic - but with the current liberal love affair with Muslims, I am not certain if what we're being given are accurate.   It could be true......but,  it could've been misrepresented by liberal media too.  And, UN can't be trusted either.

 

What?  I can't express my cynicism or skepticism? 

I've valid reasons to be skeptical, since it's the norm for news media these days to tweak their stories to suit whatever narrative they're promoting.  I've seen our own media do it numerous times on various issues!  The audience just lap it all up, except for those who look around verifying what exactly had happened.

 

Furthermore, Rohingyas had done atrocities too.  Certain parts of the world - like Africa - they do things their own way.  Tit-for-tat usually ends up in a bloodbath!

 

READ AGAIN!  If you think my OP is selling a conspiracy theory, then you've got major problems with reading comprehension!

 

You seem to want to force me to swallow what is being reported without any question.....just because the Rohingyas happen to be Muslims?  You're blind to reason. 

Now I'd say, you may be the one who's trying very hard to sell us something? 

 

Like I said,  people like you - the bullies - are a big part of the problem.  I don't know from what country you came from, or where you reside right now....but stifling people from expressing their opinion is unnatural..... and naturally, that would lead to something else. That's how things go.

Why do you think extreme-right is on the rise?  It's because of people like you!

Edited October 25, 2017 by betsy

[Michael Hardner]

14 hours ago, marcus said:

Betsy, your comments, your links and responses on this forum cement stereotypes. You are trying to sell a conspiracy theory in regards to the fleeing 400K people. Ridiculous.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/rohingya-canada-ambassador-macarthur-rae-1.4367084

600K according to this.  

I think there are limits in such discussions; if an individual promotes conspiracy theories, or wants to vilify large groups of people then you should reconsider discussing policy points that have any degree of nuance to them.  You will be wasting your time.

Perhaps take the discussion back to the greater points: should Canada have a refugee program at all?  how should one of the richest nations on earth administer its humanitarian programs?  You will probably have more of an impact, and get more out of them to discuss such basic principles than detailed responses IMO.

[betsy]

I wonder

On 10/21/2017 at 12:48 AM, marcus said:

C'mon! Be real for a second. There are around 400,000 refugees who have escaped the violence. You think they would go to that length to "set Canada up"?!

What's next? The earth is flat? 

I wonder if you're as outraged when Yazidis  were stranded  up a mountain fleeing from ISIS.

 

Quote

'Heroic' mission rescues desperate Yazidis from ISIS

http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/11/world/meast/iraq-rescue-mission/index.html

 

It took pressure to get the Liberal government from dragging its feet to bring in these people as refugees!  If there's anyone that ought to be brought in, you'd think they'd be first on the list.

 

 

 

Quote

 

Liberals accused of 'token effort' to resettle Yazidi survivors of ISIS sex slavery, torture

Opposition critics mount pressure on government to reveal target and timeline

 

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/yazidis-canada-refugees-migration-iraq-1.3863689

Edited October 25, 2017 by betsy

[hot enough]

2 hours ago, betsy said:

I wonder

I wonder if you're as outraged when Yazidis  were stranded  up a mountain fleeing from ISIS.

I wonder

I wonder why you are aren't outraged by the fact that the USA/UK created ISIS and are both totally culpable/responsible for any and all crimes precipitated by the US/UK initial supreme war crime, the illegal invasion of sovereign nations. 

[marcus]

3 hours ago, betsy said:

I wonder

I wonder if you're as outraged when Yazidis  were stranded  up a mountain fleeing from ISIS.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/11/world/meast/iraq-rescue-mission/index.html

 

It took pressure to get the Liberal government from dragging its feet to bring in these people as refugees!  If there's anyone that ought to be brought in, you'd think they'd be first on the list.

I wonder why you think my outrage and empathy is limited to the person's religion, like yours is.

I wonder why you think the Yazidis should have received special treatment, when ISIS targeted pretty much any group.

I wonder why you're still questioning whether there are 400K+ refugees fleeing violence. 

[betsy]

1 hour ago, marcus said:

I wonder why you think my outrage and empathy is limited to the person's religion, like yours is.

You've just provided the reason why:

I wonder why you think the Yazidis should have received special treatment, when ISIS targeted pretty much any group.

 

Yazidis and Christians are specifically-targetted groups!  For obvious reasons.

 

 

Quote

I wonder why you're still questioning whether there are 400K+ refugees fleeing violence. 

EH?

I'm not questioning the numbers of people - be it 10, or 10 million!  I'm questioning whether we're getting the full picture here!

Edited October 25, 2017 by betsy

[marcus]

1 hour ago, betsy said:

You've just provided the reason why:

I wonder why you think the Yazidis should have received special treatment, when ISIS targeted pretty much any group.

 

Yazidis and Christians are specifically-targetted groups!  For obvious reasons.

Wrong. Anyone who did not accept ISIS' perverted beliefs and ideals were targeted. People from all religious backgrounds were targeted. 

But because the Yazidis are Christian, you're up in arms and want to specifically help them.

1 hour ago, betsy said:

EH?

I'm not questioning the numbers of people - be it 10, or 10 million!  I'm questioning whether we're getting the full picture here!

What's the full picture you keep repeating? Why are these people escaping in large numbers? Is it to put on a show so that the West starts bringing in refugees?

Why are you avoiding the reports from Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International who have reported violence, rape and killing? 

 

[taxme]

On 9/29/2017 at 7:08 AM, DogOnPorch said:

You just KNOW there's more to this story that isn't being said. 

 

We will only ever get the marxist liberal side of the story. The one where Canadians are suppose to end up feeling guilty for these people, and then will want to bring a few thousand just to show how humane we Canadians are towards others. Canada and Canadians have done enough, and the problems still go on and on over there without a break. But there are just too many members here who feel that we have to continue to try and save the rest of the world forever no matter how much it costs the Canadian taxpayer's and their tax dollars to try and solve. Some here just cannot be reasoned with. They just want to give the appearance that they really do give a crap when in reality and is quite obvious to me that they like to talk only. How many members here took someone from one of those countries to live with them for however long it tales to get them resettled into their own home? When we take in 5 thousand from some country, that country will have that 5 thousand replaced within a year if not sooner. It's time for tough talk, not baby talk. 

[marcus]

3 hours ago, taxme said:

We will only ever get the marxist liberal side of the story. The one where Canadians are suppose to end up feeling guilty for these people, and then will want to bring a few thousand just to show how humane we Canadians are towards others. Canada and Canadians have done enough, and the problems still go on and on over there without a break. But there are just too many members here who feel that we have to continue to try and save the rest of the world forever no matter how much it costs the Canadian taxpayer's and their tax dollars to try and solve. Some here just cannot be reasoned with. They just want to give the appearance that they really do give a crap when in reality and is quite obvious to me that they like to talk only. How many members here took someone from one of those countries to live with them for however long it tales to get them resettled into their own home? When we take in 5 thousand from some country, that country will have that 5 thousand replaced within a year if not sooner. It's time for tough talk, not baby talk. 

No need to bring anyone to Canada.

I think the best thing Canada can do is to put pressure on the Burmese government and to look at our economic activity in the country.

[bush_cheney2004]

47 minutes ago, marcus said:

...I think the best thing Canada can do is to put pressure on the Burmese government and to look at our economic activity in the country.

 

Canada did put pressure on the Myanmar government...pressure to get more mining contracts...abuses and refugees be damned.

 

Quote

Canadian company Ivanhoe Mines Limited and Chinese mining interests have profited from, and in some cases colluded with the Myanmar authorities in serious human rights abuses and illegal activity around the Monywa copper mine complex, which includes the notorious Letpadaung mine, Amnesty International said in a report released today.

https://www.amnesty.ca/news/news-releases/myanmar-canadian-mining-company-colluding-in-serious-abuses-and-illegality

 

[betsy]

15 hours ago, marcus said:

Wrong. Anyone who did not accept ISIS' perverted beliefs and ideals were targeted. People from all religious backgrounds were targeted.

 

I said, "SPECIFICALLY -TARGETTED!"

Who are more blatantly obvious to reject ISIS belief than those who OBVIOUSLY aren't Muslims?  Doh?

 

People like you want to point out that there are more Muslims killed -

Of course there will be a lot of Muslim casualties where the country is predominantly Muslims! 

That's why Christians and Yazidis, and other religious groups are called MINORITIES!

 

Furthermore, ISIS hides among its own people!  If it's a war zone, how many civilians do you think will get killed?

 

Edited October 26, 2017 by betsy

[betsy]

16 hours ago, marcus said:

What's the full picture you keep repeating? Why are these people escaping in large numbers? Is it to put on a show so that the West starts bringing in refugees?

Why are you avoiding the reports from Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International who have reported violence, rape and killing? 

 

You better read the OP and get the answer from there.

 

Btw, doncha think Trudeau should have a word with China about this?  Bob Rae ought to go to China!

 

Quote

The one country that refuses to condemn the ethnic cleansing in Burma

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/democracy-post/wp/2017/09/28/the-world-is-condemning-ethnic-cleansing-in-burma-except-for-china/?utm_term=.4c99c5dbbbee

Edited October 26, 2017 by betsy

[marcus]

4 hours ago, betsy said:

I said, "SPECIFICALLY -TARGETTED!"

Who are more blatantly obvious to reject ISIS belief than those who OBVIOUSLY aren't Muslims?  Doh?

Anyone who did/does not respond to the strict interpretation of what ISIS thinks is being a Muslim is/was "SPECIFICALLY - TARGETTED!" Not just the Yazidis. For example, the Shiites Arabs and the Muslim Kurds in Iraq and Syria were also killed, raped and driven out.

I am still wondering why you go out of your way to trivialize Muslim suffering and in some cases, even deny that it happens by coming up with your "conspiracy theories" and with your fake news.

Actually, I'm not really wondering. I know why you do that. I am just pointing out that you're a bigot.

 

[taxme]

12 hours ago, marcus said:

No need to bring anyone to Canada.

I think the best thing Canada can do is to put pressure on the Burmese government and to look at our economic activity in the country.

I think that Canada should mind it's own business. I have come to the conclusion many years ago that the third world is a total waste of time and tax dollars for Canadians to keep on concerning themselves about something that we cannot control or fix. And bringing thousands of refugees over here every year is not going to solve their problem, but only will add to our problems. Enough already. 

[betsy]

19 hours ago, marcus said:

Anyone who did/does not respond to the strict interpretation of what ISIS thinks is being a Muslim is/was "SPECIFICALLY - TARGETTED!" Not just the Yazidis. For example, the Shiites Arabs and the Muslim Kurds in Iraq and Syria were also killed, raped and driven out.

I am still wondering why you go out of your way to trivialize Muslim suffering and in some cases, even deny that it happens by coming up with your "conspiracy theories" and with your fake news.

Actually, I'm not really wondering. I know why you do that. I am just pointing out that you're a bigot.

 

Those that belong to a DIFFERENT religion are automatically, SPECIFICALLY-targetted for obvious reasons!  Especially Christians! Christians can't deny and hide their Christianity.

 

Muslims can fool ISIS by going along with the standard of religiosity they want.  I'm sure moderate Muslim women have all dug up and wear their burquas.  If you're a Muslim (no matter what kind of Muslim you are), wouldn't you?   Is there so much conflict for you if you're already a Muslim?  Unless they ask you to personally do something atrocious like behead someone, it's easy for Muslims to blend in!

Christians, on the other hand, are faced with the conflict of denying Jesus Christ, or standing up.  It becomes a test for faith!   If they don't convert to Islam, they stand out!  Which part of that is so hard to grasp??

Edited October 27, 2017 by betsy

[marcus]

8 hours ago, betsy said:

Those that belong to a DIFFERENT religion are automatically, SPECIFICALLY-targetted for obvious reasons!  Especially Christians! Christians can't deny and hide their Christianity.

 

Muslims can fool ISIS by going along with the standard of religiosity they want.  I'm sure moderate Muslim women have all dug up and wear their burquas.  If you're a Muslim (no matter what kind of Muslim you are), wouldn't you?   Is there so much conflict for you if you're already a Muslim?  Unless they ask you to personally do something atrocious like behead someone, it's easy for Muslims to blend in!

Christians, on the other hand, are faced with the conflict of denying Jesus Christ, or standing up.  It becomes a test for faith!   If they don't convert to Islam, they stand out!  Which part of that is so hard to grasp??

Lots of assumptions you are trying to pass as facts. I'm not interested in debating that.

The conclusion is that you want special treatment for a specific religious group and you are questioning the struggles that Muslims have in Burma and the ISIS controlled area. You have even gone as far as suggesting that it could be a set-up and a conspiracy theory. 

[Guest]

I think God will forgive anyone who claims to be anything in order to not get their head chopped off.  What kind of God wouldn't?

That said, anyone who really, truly believes, without any doubt whatsoever, should welcome the opportunity to die for their faith.  Hello Heaven!  What's not to like?

[August1991]

The common denominator in this dispute in Burma (as in southern Thailand), or Indonesia, or Iraq, or Somalia or even Brussels and New York City is: Islam.

Well, Christianity had its major dispute in the Thirty Years War in the 1600s. But as our PM has wisely said, this is 2015.

=====

When some Muslims can't get along with Buddhists, Christians, Quebec feminists, Jews and even agnostics - then maybe we should rethink the problem.

Are Muslims oppressed? Oppressed like Jews in the 1930s, or Protestants in the 1600s? Sorry, Muslims - whichever son of a prophet, word of God they believe - have plenty of places to seek refuge. Jews in the 1930s had no refuge.

=====

Make no mistake: In this 21st century, we are all forced to line up, remove our shoes, wait for hours, get scanned, be fearful because of radical Islam.

I am not afraid of Buddhists, Sikhs, agnostics, Hindus, Christians, Jews, atheists, protestants, Roman Catholics. When boarding a plane, I am not afraid of communists or socialists or libertarians - radical or not.

It is not radical religious people that cause me problems; it is radical people of a specific religion that cause me so much grief.

This is so obvious that in 2117, when people look back, they will see our current ignorance as stunning.

Our ignorance today, in 2017, is similar to the ignorance of generals in 1917 who sent soldiers to war. 

Edited October 28, 2017 by August1991