Canadian Immigration

[taxme]

People clearly have no clue how immigration works.

I think that I have a pretty good idea and clue now as to how Canada's immigration policy is working. I believe that people are now starting to learn more about how this pro non-white immigration policy is working these days against Canada. It would appear as though it is working to destroy Canada's culture, and heritage, and traditions, and even language, and is trying to preserve all others at Canadian taxpayer's expense. I don't think that anybody that immigrates to Canada anymore wants to really become a Canadian. They don't really have too anymore.They more than likely come to Canada to make money, sens lots of money back to their countries, and take advantage of all the free goodies that Canada has to offer. And thanks to all of this massive third world immigration invasion going on, it's no wonder that I now have to wait in line to see a doctor or a specialist or have an operation done. 300,000 new immigrants ever year is clearly taking a toll on our medicare system. But our politicians don't seem to care. They want to bring in more. I think that all politicians should have to pass a competence test for common sense and logic before they can become a politician.

I think that I have a clear understanding these days of how Canada's immigration policy works in Canada. It stinks. Canada needs to shut the border gates now. We are flooding Canada with unnecassary immigrants who really have nothing to offer to Canada except grief and wasting tax dollars.

[CITIZEN_2015]

Misrepresentation of facts and statistics in above posts: What the truth is.........................

I thank God and see it as a blessing that this forum does not even closely represent Canada otherwise this country would have been as bad as Southern USA in the 60's and Rhodesia in the 70's and South Africa in the 80's!!!!!!. Though a majority membership is fair and are logical people but there are a few individuals who are hiding behind the internet to promote what they cannot otherwise do in public and also falsify statistics and hiding or distorting the truth and the facts so that incite hatred against certain population who by no choice of their own are born in certain region or have certain skin color.

One claims falsely that since there will be 300,000 new immigrants this year then this will take its toll on our medcare system. Yes his wish is for you to hate newcomers as they take your nurse and doctor away. What he purposely ignores is that there are indeed MANY doctors and nurses and medcare practitioners and professionals among these 300,000. They will join our medcare system in a few months (in case of nurses and some medical professionals) or a few years (in case of doctors and specialists since they have to pass a test before practicing). I know of a family member (my own family) who arrived in 2014 and he just passed his test in Ottawa (don't worry he has white skin). He will soon start practicing and hence taking care of many tens thousands of Canadians until he retires in 30 years. I know of another real life example (my own cousin) whose immigration papers just finalized and she is an experienced nurse (don't worry her skin is very white too) and she too will take care of tens of thousands of sick Canadians over the coming years. Neither of this real life examples intend to make money here and send it home. They wish to start life here and help the sick citizens and pay taxes and become a part of their adopted country. I have been living here for decades and paid hundreds of thousands in taxes but never sent a single dollar abroad. The claim above is a lie designed to incite hatred against newcomers. It could happen but generalization to all newcomers is very wrong.

Another poster cites government reports which says Chinese and middle eastern immigrants are not doing as well as Europeans and until recently he wished to ban ALL immigrants from those regions on the count that report says they are lower incomers (instead of better selectivity to bring only high income earners)!!!!. The report never said they are peasants or illiterates but claim that they are was made anyway. He also accused me of not caring for Canada because I wasn't born here (never mind that I have been living here for decades teaching citizen students and paying taxes all these years). Later he said because my posts show that I don't care about Canada because I opposed a regional ban on immigration on the basis that some from certain regions may end up having lower income than Europeans (like ALL Europeans end up having high income and all Chinese and Mid East lower income!!!!!).

The same poster in paragraph 1 claimed that African immigrants are of no benefit to Canada. Well my own dentist is of African origin and my teeth are great thanks to him and so are all those black ladies and gentlemen who are taking care of citizens in different ways like driving buses, cleaning offices, teaching your children, as well as other professions like doctors and engineers but yeah to his eyes someone with a colored skin can never benefit Canada.

The truth is that They want immigrants as anyone even with a peanut brain would realize that Canada needs immigrants to maintain its economic prosperity and its intact pension system. But they want European or white immigrants only. they wish to promote a WHITE only Canada. A state like South Africa decades ago. And how to do this best, is something that they cannot do in public because it will not have public support? The alternative is to do it here. Though I do agree our immigration system needs adjustments to admit the best qualified applicants and screen out the undesirable who wish to promote hate (like Muslim fanatics and Neo-Nazis alike) and a need to cut the number of immigrants so that they can be better absorbed however immigration must not be based on regional selection as proposed or white skin as is being promoted here. Unless we would like to see Canada emerge as a new South Africa in the 70's or Rhodesia which both collapsed because their ideology and what they stood for was not for 21st century. . My last words.

Edited August 31, 2016 by CITIZEN_2015

[bush_cheney2004]

I thank God and see it as a blessing that this forum does not even closely represent Canada otherwise this country would have been as bad as Southern USA in the 60's and Rhodesia in the 70's and South Africa in the 80's!!!!!!.

...or Canada in the 20's, 30's, or 40's.

https://www.thestar.com/news/immigration/2013/02/15/canadas_immigration_history_one_of_discrimination_and_exclusion.html

[Argus]

The truth is that They want immigrants as anyone even with a peanut brain would realize that Canada needs immigrants to maintain its economic prosperity and its intact pension system. But they want European or white immigrants only. they wish to promote a WHITE only Canada.

It's so good you can read people's minds when you can't even understand their posts. If you're teaching people something I have to presume it's not English comprehension or logic, neither of which you appear to be very good with.

[-TSS-]

No country in this age of automation needs immigrants except for the poorly paid low-wanted jobs. Most of those will disappear in the future; buses, trains and cars will drive themselves, cash-clerks won't be needed any more and certainly other examples where human labour will have become redundant.

Edited September 1, 2016 by -TSS-

[CITIZEN_2015]

It's so good you can read people's minds when you can't even understand their posts. If you're teaching people something I have to presume it's not English comprehension or logic, neither of which you appear to be very good with.

Talking about English comprehension this comes from a guy who after many of my posts fiercely opposing religious fanatism and my posts against ISIS and my thread calling on Trudeau to save Yazidi girls entrapped by ISIS and fierce opposition to forced hejab asked me a couple of months ago if I am an ISIS supporter!!!!!! Likely in a couple of months he will ask me if I support Neo Nazis and white supremacists!!!! SO much for your English comprehension and logic.

Edited September 1, 2016 by CITIZEN_2015

[Argus]

Talking about English comprehension this comes from a guy who after many of my posts fiercely opposing religious fanatism and my posts against ISIS and my thread calling on Trudeau to save Yazidi girls entrapped by ISIS and fierce opposition to forced hejab asked me a couple of months ago if I am an ISIS supporter!!!!!! Likely in a couple of months he will ask me if I support Neo Nazis and white supremacists!!!! SO much for your English comprehension and logic.

Do you have a cite where I called you an ISIS supporter? I'd like to see it. I do know many of our immigrants have a problem with Jews, and you have often expressed your loathing for Israel. But I don't think I ever suggested you were an ISIS supporter.

Edited September 1, 2016 by Argus

[CITIZEN_2015]

Do you have a cite where I called you an ISIS supporter? I'd like to see it. I do know many of our immigrants have a problem with Jews, and you have often expressed your loathing for Israel. But I don't think I ever suggested you were an ISIS supporter.

Geez among your over 35000 posts you expect me to find that single post!!!!!!. And you didn't suggest that I am an ISIS supporter but you asked me if I am an ISIS supporter which means you suspected I am!!!!!.Unless you wished to insult me.

I never expressed any problem with Jews and I don't think that many of immigrants have any problem with Jews either but I did post my opposition to some actions taken by Israeli government and Israeli military against innocent defenseless women and children in the past. At the same time expressed my support for Israeli people and their right to exit expressing my understanding that this Jewish nation is surrounded by very hostile and violent people and have the right to defend themselves but not at the cost of killing defenseless women and children. Does this make me an ISIS supporter??

Edited September 1, 2016 by CITIZEN_2015

[Argus]

Geez among your over 35000 posts you expect me to find that single post!!!!!!. And you didn't suggest that I am an ISIS supporter but you asked me if I am an ISIS supporter which means you suspected I am!!!!!.Unless you wished to insult me.

I don't believe I ever called you or suggested you were an ISIS supporter. An Iran supporter, perhaps.

[WestCoastRunner]

Liberals are set to vote on supporting a Conservative motion to allow Yazidi refugees to Canada in the next 4 months.  Some of the atrocities being reported:

Quote

After a warning that testimony may be "upsetting" to members of the committee and viewing public, MPs heard shocking stories of mass killings, children raped by multiple men several times a day, and mothers being forced to feed on the flesh of their own children.

What took them so long?  Should have been done a long time ago.

[eyeball]

Why would anyone even need to put such a thing to a vote in the first place? 

[Bonam]

17 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Why would anyone even need to put such a thing to a vote in the first place? 

Because bringing in the most in-your-face Muslims possible rather than the relatively quiet and reclusive Yazidi is meat for the left wing base? 

It takes a lot to persuade certain people that immigration is about economics, or that the refugee system is about helping people in real danger, when certain people just want to use both systems to spite their political opponents. 

Edited October 25, 2016 by Bonam

[eyeball]

What's even harder is persuading certain people that refugees are not immigrants - almost as hard as pointing out to certain people that Liberals are not the left.

[dre]

1 hour ago, Bonam said:

Because bringing in the most in-your-face Muslims possible rather than the relatively quiet and reclusive Yazidi is meat for the left wing base? 

It takes a lot to persuade certain people that immigration is about economics, or that the refugee system is about helping people in real danger, when certain people just want to use both systems to spite their political opponents. 

That's a straw man. I agree that economics should be the focus, and I have proposed increasing the amount of economic class immigrants over family class etc. Interestingly enough right wingers didn't seem that interested. If we doubled the number of economic class immigrants and left quotas for other immigrants the same then immigration would have a positive effect on not only GDP but per-capita GDP. Fact is we need to broaden the tax base and grow the economy. There's only 4 people working and paying taxes for each senior citizen now, and immigration accounts for almost 100% of the growth in our work force each year. We need more people to come here.

The native-born Canadian work force is dying and aging. Immigration is pretty much the only thing keeping our economy afloat.

Edited October 25, 2016 by dre

[Bonam]

11 minutes ago, dre said:

That's a straw man. I agree that economics should be the focus, and I have proposed increasing the amount of economic class immigrants over family class etc. Interestingly enough right wingers didn't seem that interested. If we doubled the number of economic class immigrants and left quotas for other immigrants the same then immigration would have a positive effect on not only GDP but per-capita GDP. Fact is we need to broaden the tax base and grow the economy. There's only 4 people working and paying taxes for each senior citizen now, and immigration accounts for almost 100% of the growth in our work force each year. We need more people to come here.

You've provided opinion and arguments about why economic immigrants should help the economy, but no real quantitative evidence. I understand your argument that you believe economic growth relies on population growth and that immigration is the source of our population growth. I just don't agree with it. I think you can have economic growth with a constant population, and certainly the world will need to figure out how to make it happen in the coming decades. In fact, many problems that chronically face society are easier to solve in the context of a constant population. For example, consider transit and road networks, which are perpetually clogged and congested because planning and construction lags decades behind population growth. Same goes for most other infrastructure. Environmental stress and destruction is also greatly reduced once cities and land use no longer need to be constantly expanded. 

Japan has managed to maintain a small but non-zero rate of economic growth despite a stagnant and aging population over the last 15 years. It is also one of the world's most technologically advanced, healthiest, most peaceful, and most socially cohesive countries. 

Edited October 25, 2016 by Bonam

[Argus]

18 hours ago, WestCoastRunner said:

Liberals are set to vote on supporting a Conservative motion to allow Yazidi refugees to Canada in the next 4 months.  Some of the atrocities being reported:

What took them so long?  Should have been done a long time ago.

I suspect that since the Conservatives wanted to give them preferential treatment the Liberals automatically opposed giving them preferential treatment. 

[Argus]

14 hours ago, dre said:

That's a straw man. I agree that economics should be the focus, and I have proposed increasing the amount of economic class immigrants over family class etc. Interestingly enough right wingers didn't seem that interested.

The Conservatives tried this, have been trying it for a decade. It hasn't worked. Despite their increasing focus on 'skilled immigrants' the economic performance of immigrants continues to deteriorate. Why? For one thing the gap between the third world, it's standards, culture, education, and job skill requirements in Canada continues to widen. Their universities are often not reliable in terms of the education supplied being equivalent to Canada, or in the integrity of their grading. And repeated studies have emphasized the lack of English/French literacy among newcomers as another major source of their economic failing. You can get by on fractured English if you're a carpenter or roofer but not if you're an engineer.

The theoretical literature on immigration and economic growth suggests that the impact of' immigrants on natives' income growth depends crucially on the human capital levels of the immigrants. Empirical research on this question has yielded conflicting answers, and more work on this issue is needed. 

Quote

If we doubled the number of economic class immigrants and left quotas for other immigrants the same then immigration would have a positive effect on not only GDP but per-capita GDP.

Your opinion, that's all

“I am very doubtful that it is possible to predict, with any degree of certainty, how the current government's plan to 'substantially increase' immigration levels will impact the Canadian economy - and the well-being of both native born and immigrant Canadians - in the long run. In the past, we might have feared that immigrant engineers would end up driving taxis. Now that uber and self-driving cars are wiping out taxi driver jobs, it's hard to know what will happen.”   

http://worthwhile.typepad.com/worthwhile_canadian_initi/2016/10/why-is-it-so-hard-to-know-the-relationship-between-immigration-and-economic-performance.html

Quote

The native-born Canadian work force is dying and aging. Immigration is pretty much the only thing keeping our economy afloat.

And yet demographics experts say high immigration will have no appreciable impact on our aging workforce.

Edited October 25, 2016 by Argus

[dre]

3 hours ago, Argus said:

 

Your opinion, that's all

 

Nope, not my opinion. Its the opinion of economists that have studied the impact of immigration on the economy.

Quote

 

In Prof. Dungan’s forecasting model, devised with two co-authors, an increase of 100,000 immigrants to Canada (chosen under the current selection model) would result in a 2.3-per-cent increase in real GDP over 10 years. But since the population would increase by 2.6 per cent over that period, GDP per capita could actually decline slightly.

However, if Canada were to double the number of economic-class migrants only, as The Globe and Mail has proposed, average entry wages for all immigrants would rise by between 5 and 6 per cent, according to a model devised by Queen’s University economist Charles Beach.

 

 

Quote

And yet demographics experts say high immigration will have no appreciable impact on our aging workforce.

Actually it will have a huge positive effect. Those workers are going to retire soon, and we need to increase GDP to pay for that. That is not going to happen by allowing a large contraction in the labor force. 

Edited October 25, 2016 by dre

[square]

I hear that the Liberals want to bring in 400k-450k immigrants where are these immigrants coming from?

[eyeball]

Earth.

[Casapaz]

High immigration is not going to do much for the GDP.  If they want to actually improve the GDP number,  they should seriously consider basic income.

Immigration is only going to strain housing prices more where they are already high and possibly displace and alienate the people who are already here in wage poverty. I get that they are trying to keep the real estate bubble rising/not falling for economic reasons but, increasing immigration is not what we need even more of now.

Boomers retiring does not mean that they can replace some of  those good taxpaying jobs with immigrants that would be more motivated than canadians to do them.. if these jobs still exist. Many of these jobs companies are too lazy to train for or demand some specialized technical skill that is not so common. Really, companies are just fishing in the crowded labour pool.

But, with basic income, we could get lots of people back into the labour force, and begin repairing this severely anemic economy which is lacking jobs primarily because so little spending power/ wage bargaining power of those that are working in the economy now.

[?Impact]

12 hours ago, square said:

I hear that the Liberals want to bring in 400k-450k immigrants where are these immigrants coming from?

That is the number attributed to the Advisory Council on Economic Growth. We are still waiting to see what the Liberals will do, John McCallum said that number is huge and may not be a universal view across the country.

[Argus]

On 10/25/2016 at 3:52 PM, dre said:

Nope, not my opinion. Its the opinion of economists that have studied the impact of immigration on the economy.

I quoted an economist and you ignored it. The fact is economists can't predict what impact more immigration will have because they can't have any idea how many of them will be economically successful. Merely saying the magic word "skilled' is essentially meaningless. Lots of 'skilled immigrants' are on welfare or driving cabs. As professor Wooley stated in the quote you ignored

The theoretical literature on immigration and economic growth suggests that the impact of' immigrants on natives' income growth depends crucially on the human capital levels of the immigrants. 

Quote

Actually it will have a huge positive effect. Those workers are going to retire soon, and we need to increase GDP to pay for that. That is not going to happen by allowing a large contraction in the labor force. 

Every demographics expert I've quoted has said the opposite. This will not lower the average age by any meaningful level - particularly since we give no extra points for youth in immigration. We take lots of old people and lots of middle aged people. And even if we focused on young people we'd have to quadruple immigration, not increase it by 50%, and at that level you're talking about simply replacing the existing population with a foreign population.

Edited October 26, 2016 by Argus

[taxme]

Is it time that we thought about changing our present day pro-third world immigration policy, and reverse that policy. Presently, Canada takes in approx. 80% of it's new immigrants from third world countries, and this is starting to upset the balance of the present day white majority. We are always being told that we need more immigration because of our low white birth rate. But maybe that is not the case. Maybe as to why it would appear as though the white birth rate appears to be on the decline is because we keep bringing in way more non-white immigrants rather than white immigrants. Maybe today what Canada should be doing now is to increase white immigration, and lower the amount of non-white immigration. That my be the start of getting our numbers up to where they were just over fifty to sixty years ago. Personally, I believe that there has been a concerted effort of some kind of program going on by our government to want to create a situation where white people will eventually end up becoming a minority in Canada. At least that is the way I am reading it now. Anyone here see anything wrong with this new immigration policy of mine? Over. 

[Michael Hardner]

Topic "Is it time to change our current immigration policy" was merged here.