Still Going to Buy the F-35, Really?

[Dougie93]

20 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

As a Canadian soldier your duty is to Canada, with or without the Queen

The Queen is the country, I only swore an oath to bear true and faithful allegiance to HM Queen Elizabeth II heirs & successors, otherwise known as the House of Windsor.

Canada is not a republic, I owe no allegiance to the public, Canada is a monarchy and the British Crown still.  British North American, suck it, Canada.

By the Canada Act, affirmed by the Supreme Court of Canada, I am bound to no particular allegiance to Canadian Confederation, which is all that "Canada" is.

 

American F-35A Panthers arriving in Europe at Latvia in support of NATO. 

 

[Zeitgeist]

You don’t understand what the Crown means. It’s a metaphor for the commons, a part standing for the whole, a synecdoche.  It’s like “All hands on deck”.  Crown land in Canada is the people’s land.  That’s fundamental.  The Head of State in parliamentary democracy is a largely symbolic function.  You lean on the Queen as though all the work of a country’s military was to serve one person, a justification for biting the hand that fed you, the Canadian taxpayers.  Basically you refuse to show allegiance to the country you were supposed to defend.   That fact undermines your credibility on all other matters.   It doesn’t matter.   The taxpayers will still pay the angry fogey his pension.  Just keep in mind that Canada will persist and get stronger.  The question is not if but how?  What kind of country do we want?  I suggest working on that instead of constantly launching unfair extreme attacks.  You catch more flies with honey.  Work for improvement rather than destruction.  

Edited September 4, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[Dougie93]

51 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Leave the dance with the one who bring ya.  

There's nobody worth dancing with in a Post National State Hippie Commune.

I don't date crazy chicks. i have a lovely wife of my own.

Free individual who chooses my dance partners, I certainly never signed away my right to that at any juncture.

Although frankly,  Liz Windsor is the Boss, but she was never my favorite royal.

I was always partial to her younger sister, she liked to party.

Edited September 4, 2019 by Dougie93

[Dougie93]

9 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

You don’t understand what the Crown means.

It's all testable in court, I am bound only by my oath to the Queen, just like everyone else who works or worked for the government,

I am not bound, ethically, morally, nor legally, to a public, nor "commons", nor federation in fact.

[Dougie93]

54 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

 I suggest working on that instead of constantly launching unfair extreme attacks.  You catch more flies with honey.  Work for improvement rather than destruction.  

I am not trying to convince you, I'm not trying to catch any flies

I have joined those who will bring the Confederation down by peaceful democratic means

To include speaking the truth of the tyrannical, totalitarian and utterly irredeemable nature of the failed state of Confederation.

To include what a criminally fraudulent boondoggle the Department of National Defence so obviously is.

 

American F-35A Panthers arriving in the  Persian Gulf at the UAE.   When it comes time to bomb Iran, Canada will need its CF-35A's for First Night Of War. (FNOW)

 

Edited September 4, 2019 by Dougie93

[Dougie93]

7 hours ago, Army Guy said:

What missile strike , from CF-18's that are 40 years old give me a break......

What missile strike indeed.   AGM-65 Maverick? I don't know how many they have left in the inventory, but it's not exactly a TLAM.

BTW, for all you F-15 Super Eagle fans?

Guess what? 

That's right, the tiny city state the Republic of Singapore flies them already.

Singapura.  Lion City.

 

[Dougie93]

Of course, the non stealth CF-18's wouldn't get past the RSAF's state of the art Israeli Gulfstream G550 based phased array radar AWACS.

Another capability Canada has never had, but which a tiny city state with population and economy of a single Canadian province, is flying right now.

 

[Dougie93]

HM Royal Navy Fleet Air Arm Lockheed Martin F-35B Lightning II Sea Panther.   

 

[Dougie93]

- "Easier to fly, easier to maintain"

 

[bush_cheney2004]

Remember folks....from 2015:

 

Quote

We will not buy the F-35 stealth fighter-bomber.

We will immediately launch an open and transparent competition to replace the CF-18 fighter aircraft. The primary mission of our fighter aircraft should remain the defence of North America, not stealth first-strike capability.

We will reduce the procurement budget for replacing the CF-18s, and will instead purchase one of the many, lower-priced options that better match Canada’s defence needs.

https://www.liberal.ca/realchange/f-35/

 

[bush_cheney2004]

Who is buying F-35s ?    They are selling like hotcakes.    Canada...with an asterisk !!

 

 

https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/06/22/the-countries-where-f-35-sales-are-taking-off/

Edited September 5, 2019 by bush_cheney2004

[Dougie93]

institutional inertia is inexorable in Canada.    DND will get its way in the end.

They had a role for the CF-18 and it was not tactical.   The role is strategic.   Political leverage with Washington.

In order to acheive that, Canada has to have some ways to "punch above its weight class".   Something relevant to Washington.

Super Hornet is not that.   Only F-35 gives the Government the leverage they seek, the right to be in the room with the Contact Group.

They may continue to punt like they did with Sea King, but eventually they will circle back and buy the Lightning II Panther in the end.

I think they should go with Lightning II Cougar tho.  Canadianize it,  and as an homage to 410 'Cougar' Squadron.

Plus older chicks are hot.  Older but bolder.

Edited September 5, 2019 by Dougie93

[Zeitgeist]

14 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

institutional inertia is inexorable in Canada.    DND will get its way in the end.

They had a role for the CF-18 and it was not tactical.   The role is strategic.   Political leverage with Washington.

In order to acheive that, Canada has to have some ways to "punch above its weight class".   Something relevant to Washington.

Super Hornet is not that.   Only F-35 gives the Government the leverage they seek, the right to be in the room with the Contact Group.

They may continue to punt like they did with Sea King, but eventually they will circle back and buy the Lightning II Panther in the end.

I think they should go with Lightning II Cougar tho.  Canadianize it,  and as an homage to 410 'Cougar' Squadron.

Plus older chicks are hot.  Older but bolder.

I'm with you on that.  Let's get them asap.  I say let's get more than 100 of them.  That's five large squadrons. 

[Army Guy]

16 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

You don’t understand what the Crown means. It’s a metaphor for the commons, a part standing for the whole, a synecdoche.  It’s like “All hands on deck”.  Crown land in Canada is the people’s land.  That’s fundamental.  The Head of State in parliamentary democracy is a largely symbolic function.  You lean on the Queen as though all the work of a country’s military was to serve one person, a justification for biting the hand that fed you, the Canadian taxpayers.  Basically you refuse to show allegiance to the country you were supposed to defend.   That fact undermines your credibility on all other matters.   It doesn’t matter.   The taxpayers will still pay the angry fogey his pension.  Just keep in mind that Canada will persist and get stronger.  The question is not if but how?  What kind of country do we want?  I suggest working on that instead of constantly launching unfair extreme attacks.  You catch more flies with honey.  Work for improvement rather than destruction.  

Explain this for me , why is it we swear our allegiance to the Queen and not to the country or government of Canada, It was not meant as some metaphor , with some secret meaning,  it is a built in safety device so our own government could not use the military against it's own people, or for it's own advantage with out the permission of the governor General or the Queen.. And while it may seem symbolic to you , the fact remains it is how it is written in our laws and governmental practices...which we are to lazy or it is to time consuming to change our type of government.

So dougie is correct when leaning on the Queen as the sole person our military, RCMP and who ever else swears allegiance to the Queen is responsible to....

As for the Military being responsible to the Public....not so, Yes you pay taxes to the government, who spends those taxes on what ever it wants.... but if that government decides they are going to use military force on the public , with the governor blessing of course that is what is going to happen....regardless of how much taxes you have paid or paying...So in reality the government is the hand that feeds us....

Here is where in my opinion you as a tax payer lose credibility, You claim responsibility of paying the bills,  making decisions of what bills are going to get paid, and yet veterans which have done nothing but serve you and this nation, still have to take the nation to court to receive benefits that every Canadian already receives, why is it you stop all of that in order to save a few bucks....and why is it the current government has done little to return those benefits ? Can you see why vets and soldiers are getting a little bitter, here your demanding Dougies  loyality, like his serving and sacrifices were not enough ....and you have shown nothing but a cold shoulder to....What kind of country do we want, lets start with one that treats its soldiers as any other citizen gets treated, nothing more nothing less...we are one of the most giving nations in the world, but we can not give our vets the same treatment as you are entitled to. 

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I'm with you on that.  Let's get them asap.  I say let's get more than 100 of them.  That's five large squadrons. 

That is certainly what the RCAF wants. 

Five 'Guns' Squadrons of sixteen ready jets in four flights, Panther is optimized to fight in packs of four.

Then twenty spares to be used for training, testing,  and to rotate through maintenance.

 

4 Wing Cold Lake;

401 'Ram' Tactical Fighter Squadron.

409 'Nighthawk' Tactical Fighter Squadron

410 'Cougar' Tactical Fighter Squadron

3e Escadre Bagotville;

425^e Escadron d'appui tactique 'Allouette'

433 'Porcupine' Tactical Fighter Squadron

 

[Dougie93]

2 hours ago, Army Guy said:

Explain this for me , why is it we swear our allegiance to the Queen and not to the country or government of Canada, It was not meant as some metaphor , with some secret meaning,  it is a built in safety device so our own government could not use the military against it's own people, or for it's own advantage with out the permission of the governor General or the Queen.. And while it may seem symbolic to you , the fact remains it is how it is written in our laws and governmental practices...which we are to lazy or it is to time consuming to change our type of government.

So dougie is correct when leaning on the Queen as the sole person our military, RCMP and who ever else swears allegiance to the Queen is responsible to....

Indeed.   Her Majesty is the personage of the Canadian Constitution. 

The living embodiment of British Parliamentary Supremacy founded in 1688 and passed down to Canada in 1763.

The Queen is above both the Confederation and the Government of Canada

In the same way the United States Constitution is above the American Union and Federal Government.

It's classical liberal and Western, but it is not a republic.  And unlike America, it is certainly not a revolutionary republic.

The Queen is the country, she owns all the lands, legal title holder, we only free hold,  and no law can be passed without her assent.  

That assent is by executed by Parliament, unless there is a constitutional crisis. 

Constitutional Monarchy;  HM Queen; break glass in case of crisis or war or both.

The Governor General is Viceroy.  Deputy.   For minor crises, the Viceroy may be able to solve it at the earliest opportunity.

None the less, if not, the Queen remains the final arbiter, as Canada remains, constitutionally, in the Canada Act,  under the rule of the British Crown.

British is not a race, British is not a place, British is a system of governance called Parliamentary Supremacy, but that is still defended and upheld by a Crown.

God save the Queen.   Dieu et mon droit.   E2R means what it says.  Pro Patria is to the House of Windsor not Ottawa.

Edited September 5, 2019 by Dougie93

[Dougie93]

Understand that the chain of command in Canada does not actually go through the PMO nor the CDS.

The Prime Minister is not in command of anything.  His role is simply to select a Minister for National Defence to represent the Queen.

The Chief of the Defence Staff is not a commander, Staff is Staff, Staff does not command.

The Minister for National Defence represents Parliament, which again,  is the Queen.

The commanders in the military report to Her through him.

The role of the CDS is merely to advise, to help the MND to make his decisions on behalf of the Commander-in-Chief at Buckingham Palace whom he swore the oath to.

In practice Ottawa is all cronyism.  None the less, constitutionally, legally, the above is the actual chain of command.

Parliamentary Supremacy & Constitutional Monarchy is liberal, there are checks and balances, nobody in theory can be elected to be dictator.

The weakness is that it is an honour system.  It relies on men of quality to defend and uphold the oaths they took of their own free will.

If the MP's act dishonorably and make themselves into cronies, then the system breaks down, as it has now and for many years in Canada.

Among the many corrosive effects of entrenched Canadian crony culture, has been the functional collapse of the armed forces.

It's rusted out, rotten to the core, and ramshackle.  Cronyism is the only way to get ahead above the tactical level.  The cronyism has broken it beyond repair.

Institutions are living things.  The torch passed down with failing hands to thee.   But they can be killed.  It's not a miraculous flame, it can go out forever.

So again, with this Boutique Military, Canada simply cannot generate full spectrum anymore, and by extension all attempts to do it are just boondoggles for the MICC

As the MICC, I am certainly willing to take Canada's money, it will be paid in American dollars, so it's all Green to me.

I don't recommend it, but if Canada insists on being in the Contact Group First Night Of War, so be it, the customer is always right.

Disaster Capitalism FTW.  Eagle With Thunderbolts In Talons Grasped. Market Forces.  Deo Vindice

At Lockheed Martin; We Never Forget Who We Are Working For.

Edited September 5, 2019 by Dougie93

[Zeitgeist]

There’s no Viceroy in Canada.  There’s a Governor General who functions as the Head of State and signs off on all Parliamentary bills.  No further assent required above the GG, who is appointed by the PM of Canada, the elected leader of the party that wins the most seats.  Canadians have total control over all Canadian government decisions, period.  The Queen is a figurehead, culturally and historically significant, but not in terms of decision making.  For the rare instances that the Head of State dissolves Parliament, that role is the GG’s. 

If you wish to worship a Caesar, Dougie, in Canada right now that’s Julie Payette, by appointment of PM Justin Trudeau.  Yes Queen Elizabeth 2 signs off on that.  She has to.  If she did not, or if any other monarch did not, that would probably be the beginning of the end of the monarch in Canada.  It’s never happened.  

Edited September 5, 2019 by Zeitgeist

[Dougie93]

2 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

There’s no Viceroy in Canada.  There’s a Governor General who functions as the Head of State and signs off on all Parliamentary bills.  No further assent required above the GG, who is appointed by the PM of Canada, the elected leader of the party that wins the most seats.  Canadians have total control over all Canadian government decisions, period.  The Queen is a figurehead, culturally and historically significant, but not in terms of decision making.  For the rare instances that the Head of State dissolves Parliament, that role is the GG’s. 

If you wish to worship a Caesar, Dougie, in Canada right now that’s Julie Payette, by appointment of PM Justin Trudeau.  Yes Queen Elizabeth 2 signs off on that.  She has to.  If she did not, or if any other monarch did not, that would probably be the beginning of the end of the monarch in Canada.  It’s never happened.  

When the monarchy in Canada falls, any further fealty I have to Canada goes with it

If Elizabeth Windsor is not Queen of Canada, then I owe Canada absolutely nothing other than taxes due to residency.

If that is what you assert, then you can't make any demands of fealty from me, I am only bound to oaths which I took of my own  free will

The only binding oath I took was to HM Queen Elizabeth II heirs and successors, of which Julie Payette is not one,

Julie Payette is not in my chain of command at this juncture, she can be hired and fired by the government, so obviously she is not the Sovereign.

If you want to try to impose Julie Payette on me as the sovereign, then I am counterrevolutionary in the face of that, and the courts will back me to the hilt, I'm quite sure.

Governor General is just another expression meaning Viceroy, if you don't know it, that's not my problem, you and Julie Payette can go eat a bag of dicks together for all I care.

If Canada makes itself into a republic, no problemo, then I'm an American by default.

I'll just fly Old Glory and represent Lockheed Martin and play Lee Greenwood on the loud speakers.

E Pluribus Unum.  Shot Heard Round The World.   Can't kill an idea.

 

Edited September 6, 2019 by Dougie93

[Dougie93]

Lightning II Panther low and slow pass over 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

Lockheed Martin shareholders salute the American Commander-in-Chief.

Leader of the Free World.

Big Daddy Trump President of Canada.

 

[Zeitgeist]

I’m not the guy who got on my knees and voted for JT.  You’ve made your disdain for your homeland clear, yet you support the forces in Canada that are the source of your disdain.  Illogical, bizarre, and treacherous.  

On a lighter note, the F-35’s seem to be the front runner in Canada’s competition tender.  88 of these will go a long way to rebuilding the CAF.  

[Dougie93]

12 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

I’m not the guy who got on my knees and voted for JT.  You’ve made your disdain for your homeland clear, yet you support the forces in Canada that are the source of your disdain.  Illogical, bizarre, and treacherous.  

On a lighter note, the F-35’s seem to be the front runner in Canada’s competition tender.  88 of these will go a long way to rebuilding the CAF.  

I'm transactional when it comes to voting, Trudeau delivered on two key imperatives.   Legal dope, and inciting chaos. 

Chaos being a ladder for we Pequistes. Dope being amongst the exercising of liberties to the fullest extent possible behind the Iron Curtain of Soviet Canada.

It is opiate for the masses, but I don't drink the kool-aid with the dope, so it's all good, quid pro quo, eyes wide open.

As for Lightning II Panther, if Canada lives up to its JSF commitments, Lockheed Martin will as well.

Foxtrot Three Five Alpha being evaluated by the Swiss Air Force, short field mountain operations demonstration.

 

Edited September 6, 2019 by Dougie93

[Dougie93]

HM Royal Air Force Lockheed Martin F-35B Lightning II Panther

No. 617 (Dambusters) Squadron

RAF Marham

 

[Dougie93]

USAF Lockheed Martin F-35A Lightining II Panther

Forward deployed to the United Kingdom

UKUSSA low level through the Mach Loop in Wales.

 

[Dougie93]

Lockheed Martin selects Raytheon to provide the next generation AN/AAS-37 DAS.