Britain Sets Date for EU Referendum -- Brexit

[scribblet]

The date for the UK referendum on leaving the EU has been set for June, 2016. IMO Britain will not get the reforms they want if they stay which will see the end of the U.K. in the not too far distant future. I'm not clear on what it could mean for the U.K. economically so which is the lesser of the two evils. From what I've read I would vote to leave unless they agree to serious reforms first. I'm going out on a limb here to predict that the vote to leave the EU will win.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/E/EU_BRITAIN_EUROPE?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Cameron said if Britons decided to remain in the EU, he would seek continued reforms to address their concerns about job losses and benefit payments to EU migrants seeking work in Britain.

[overthere]

I give credit to Cameron, who is following through on his promises. He is a supporter of EU membership, and it is a considerable polticial risk for him to go through with a referendum. Of course, it is also a risk to not have one.

I predict they will stay in the EU, but will act independently more and more.

The Brits have never accepted the EU monetary policy much, they are very unlikely to live with a much more integrated fiscal policy since a certain loss of soveirngty is inescapable then.

They will stay and act in their best interest overall, even if contrary to EU dictates. The Eu cannot afford to have the UK abandon ship.

[taxme]

The problem with the EU is that the European people don't get to vote for the leaders of the EU or what they make as laws. The EU is a dictatorship where the people have no say. The EU kind of reminds me of communism. The people are forced to listen but are not allowed to speak and ask questions. The British people would be wise to boot the EU out of their lives completely. Britons need to take back their freedoms lost, and once again be able to make their own laws, rules and regulations, and not be dictated too from New World Order Brussels. Brussels is pretty much the headquarters for the world.

[August1991]

And the UK may in solidarity join Norway (another so-called socialist society) in not being part of the EU

or even sharing its currency.

Bernie Sanders wants America to imitate Scandinavia. What would happen to Canada if Alberta imitated Norway?

Edited February 22, 2016 by August1991

[scribblet]

The EU has made some slight concessions but not enough IMO to alleviate the U.K. problems. The EU is far too dogmatic and blinkered as the migrant crisis has shown, not to mention it's lack of ability to manage it properly.

Cameron did not get the changes he wanted which could be a real problem for some voters but others are downplaying the economic risks to leaving.

There's also talk about reinstating passport requirements to cross borders which could see the collapse of the Schengen Agreement, thus increasing costs for goods etc.

[overthere]

The problem with the EU is that the European people don't get to vote for the leaders of the EU or what they make as laws. The EU is a dictatorship where the people have no say. The EU kind of reminds me of communism. The people are forced to listen but are not allowed to speak and ask questions. The British people would be wise to boot the EU out of their lives completely. Britons need to take back their freedoms lost, and once again be able to make their own laws, rules and regulations, and not be dictated too from New World Order Brussels. Brussels is pretty much the headquarters for the world.

No the problem with the EU is that member countries cannot make the next crucial step. The EU has a more or less united united monetary policy(with countries like UK keeping their own currency). But the recent global recession illustrated, as does the huge financial problems with Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal and Ireland that it aint gonna work unless there is also a coherent fiscal policy with ti. Since that means all countries will have to give up some big decision on their own and toe the EU line, many of them will balk. Brussels does not want that to happen, and doubly so with the wealthier northern economies like UK. Without at least a pretense of working for the common good, the union is broken.

I predict that if the Brexit campaign in the UK gathers much more steam, the EU will return to the table and do whatever they have to to keep the UK in the fold. They'll have to.

[TimG]

No the problem with the EU is that member countries cannot make the next crucial step.

You assume the next step is desirable. Democracy ultimately means local control and that works against the creation of superstates. It unlikely that a state the size of the US or Canada could be assembled today with the expectations of control that exist today.

[jbg]

The date for the UK referendum on leaving the EU has been set for June, 2016. IMO Britain will not get the reforms they want if they stay which will see the end of the U.K. in the not too far distant future. I'm not clear on what it could mean for the U.K. economically so which is the lesser of the two evils. From what I've read I would vote to leave unless they agree to serious reforms first. I'm going out on a limb here to predict that the vote to leave the EU will win.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/E/EU_BRITAIN_EUROPE?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

Cameron said if Britons decided to remain in the EU, he would seek continued reforms to address their concerns about job losses and benefit payments to EU migrants seeking work in Britain.

The date is June 23, 2016 and I hope they exit. In an excellent article, ‘Brexit of Champions’: How Britain May Trigger A Political Earthquake Seth Lipsky quotes the American Spectator for the phrase Brexit of Champions (link).

Britain and the EU are truly a poor fit. The UK's natural allies are its successful offspring, such countries as the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Israel and India. These countries have been successful, forward looking countries. The continental EU countries are in many respects frozen in time. They're beautiful museum pieces but like their many churches largely bereft of worshipers, are places of the past, not the future. Britain joined the EU in 1973, at a time when the U.S. was crippled by the Vietnam War and its opposition, Watergate, price controls, inflation and the energy crisis.

Now the UK and other freedom-loving countries should be looking to the future, not to the mercantalist, bureaucratic past..

[Argus]

The Scottish are much more enamored of the EU than the rest of the UK is. Its possible a UK exit from the EU would precipitate another Scottish referendum, and then a Scottish exit from the UK.

[-TSS-]

I'm confident that the no-campaign will win despite the all-out attack by the establishment to provoke fear.

[SpankyMcFarland]

The date is June 23, 2016 and I hope they exit. In an excellent article, ‘Brexit of Champions’: How Britain May Trigger A Political Earthquake Seth Lipsky quotes the American Spectator for the phrase Brexit of Champions (link). Britain and the EU are truly a poor fit. The UK's natural allies are its successful offspring, such countries as the United States, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Singapore, Israel and India. These countries have been successful, forward looking countries. The continental EU countries are in many respects frozen in time. They're beautiful museum pieces but like their many churches largely bereft of worshipers, are places of the past, not the future. Britain joined the EU in 1973, at a time when the U.S. was crippled by the Vietnam War and its opposition, Watergate, price controls, inflation and the energy crisis.

Now the UK and other freedom-loving countries should be looking to the future, not to the mercantalist, bureaucratic past..

Have you attended any Anglican services in Britain recently? Small, elderly crowds.

[overthere]

You assume the next step is desirable. Democracy ultimately means local control and that works against the creation of superstates. It unlikely that a state the size of the US or Canada could be assembled today with the expectations of control that exist today.

I am not assuming anything. What I said was that the EU is at turning point, and member states (not limited to the UK by any means) know that the next logical step is to have a common fiscal policy. That does not imply a loss of soveirngty, it guarantees that loss to all member states. It is a huge and precarious step for the EU..

The European experience in the 2008 global crisis was hobbled terribly by an inability to respond effectively and jointly. A monetary policy, a shared currency, isn't nearly enough.

But the power players in this experiment know all that, which is why they are and have been trying to dial it all down for a few years. They are overtaken by events again in recent times: a massive refugees crisis, military adventures by Russia, Greece and the fiscal cesspool of PIGS, and one of their very important members talking seriously of departing.

Oh and whomever noted that the EU does not have eelcted members, every citizen of the EU votes on MPs for the Euro Parliament.

[dre]

No the problem with the EU is that member countries cannot make the next crucial step. The EU has a more or less united united monetary policy(with countries like UK keeping their own currency). But the recent global recession illustrated, as does the huge financial problems with Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal and Ireland that it aint gonna work unless there is also a coherent fiscal policy with ti. Since that means all countries will have to give up some big decision on their own and toe the EU line, many of them will balk. Brussels does not want that to happen, and doubly so with the wealthier northern economies like UK. Without at least a pretense of working for the common good, the union is broken.

I predict that if the Brexit campaign in the UK gathers much more steam, the EU will return to the table and do whatever they have to to keep the UK in the fold. They'll have to.

The problem with the EU is that surrendering control of your currency to the ECB is fundamentally a really really bad idea. A country with an agrarian economy like Greece should not have the same interest rates and currency values as a country like Germany. They lose the ability to craft a monetary policy that suits their economies. Also the EU framework puts way too much power in the hands of un-elected beaurocrats and bankers. Id be surprised if any country that had an honest referendum would choose to fully accept the framework... except maybe Germany and France.

[GostHacked]

If the UK decides to leave the EU, you are going to see a few other nations follow suit. I would suspect France, Germany to hold referendums soon after. Or I guess the post Soviet states that broke off during the Cold War that are currently in the EU might consider leaving it before that.

The problem with the EU is that surrendering control of your currency to the ECB is fundamentally a really really bad idea.

Giving up the control of the nations currency and adopting another you still don't control, to me is just crazy, insane, ect. I also find it ironic that the UK was a big supporter of setting up the EU and now wants to get out. What gives?

[scribblet]

Not just currency but they lost control of their borders. Campbell doesn't want out, he's for staying put but people want more control over their borders (and welfare benefits) so they can control immigration.

[-TSS-]

London mayor Boris Johnson supports leaving the EU, which is a massive boost for the leave-campaign. The mayor of a major global multicultural city supports leaving. The leave-side can no longer be described as sad little Englanders who just cant keep up with times.

[Argus]

It's odd that there's been so little discussion on this subject, given the insatiable news coverage and its potential to roil markets. I understand both sides arguments, and agree with much of what both sides are saying. I think both 'sides' are also wildly exaggerating the long term impacts, but especially the Remain side.

Britain leaving isn't going to destroy their economy, nor will it preclude them being a member of any number of economic treaties or organizations, including ones with Europe. Hell, Canada has been negotiating free trade with Europe, so an independent Britain could certainly do the same.

The problem with the EU is it's largely run by technocrats and foreign ones at that. And it's rules often have little resemblance to reality, particularly on immigration. Millions of foreigners, mostly eastern Europeans, are now living and working in Britain, and the UK really has no say in that. How can you claim to have national sovereignty without even the ability to control who crosses your borders and who stays to live and work there?

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-06-21/brexit-referendum-hangs-in-balance-as-campaign-enters-final-day

Immigration is just one part of the problem. Under current EU regulations, anyone from an EU member country can come to Britain. When Polish citizens got the right to come, experts forecast that up to 13,000 might arrive. Instead, more than 600,000 showed up.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/those-deranged-brexiters/article30530244/

Edited June 22, 2016 by Argus

[Guest]

At the risk of being shot, I'm going with my sister and backing remain. My brother is leave, I'll be seeing them both in August. They can explain the finer points to me then.

[overthere]

The Leave camp is hampered by the idiocy of those that cling to the past. They think that leaving will result in some sort of noble Rule Brittania situation, with the UK restored to some kind of global role. It won't. And the economy will be damaged. London is still a great city mainly because it is a world financial center. That would change dramatically with Brexit.

I think sanity will prevail and they will stay.

I don't know why the Brits don't just go it alone on immigration policies. Other large EU players have put their foot down on protecting themselves from Brussels. The EU is at a delicate place: to succeed they need to expand control and have a common fiscal policy. Several countries won't play along, because of the inevitable loss of soveriegnty. The UK has more wiggle room than they seem to want to exercise.

[-TSS-]

I truly hope Brexit wins and the corrupt EU-bosses get their asses kicked. Realistically though remain will win. People have been scaremongered to believe that the world will come to an end if Britain leaves the EU.

[Rue]

London mayor Boris Johnson supports leaving the EU, which is a massive boost for the leave-campaign. The mayor of a major global multicultural city supports leaving. The leave-side can no longer be described as sad little Englanders who just cant keep up with times.

Boris Johnson is a former communist and avowed left wing socialist Perhaps some of the people on this forum who continue to try define all anti EU people as right wing might want to ponder that one. Whether its too difficult to grasp I do not know-it seems so for some.

[Rue]

I truly hope Brexit wins and the corrupt EU-bosses get their asses kicked. Realistically though remain will win. People have been scaremongered to believe that the world will come to an end if Britain leaves the EU.

I agree with you. I say this though, I respect the right for UK citizens to decide their feet either way. Me I think the EU as a government structure is redundant and corrupt and wasteful. I think free trade between EU states does not require a massive wasteful layer of government-that is insane.

As for the immigration policies of each nation and the movement of workers between nations for me personally its a scam to assure the breaking of trade unions and an over supply of desperate people willing to accept any work at any price.

Massive floods of immigration displace lower and middle class workers, not those who control the means of production. Damn I sound like a commie.

Where's my beret.

I also think to be fair if you can speak many languages and have certain professional skills, open borders could be good for you but how many people have professions and linguistic gifts to take advantage of this movement?

I would love to have a gift of tongue and have a profession that can move from country to country. Alas my days of being an escort and strip dancer are over.

Edited June 22, 2016 by Rue

[-TSS-]

I'm disappointed if remain wins but certainly not surprised.

[Argus]

How backward and antiquated is the British voting system that at almost one in the morning they are still only just starting to get vote counts?

[Guest]

How backward and antiquated is the British voting system that at almost one in the morning they are still only just starting to get vote counts?

They count them twice. It looks like we're going to leave. I wonder if I'm going to be happier than usual that I have the right of abode in Canada over the next while.

I hope it works out...