Trudeau What a Sellout.

[G Huxley]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-legalizing-pot-global-treaties-1.3390745

How predictable. Wasn't it obvious that this was coming? Big brother America told Trudeau he wasn't allowed to do anything they didn't want him to do. National sovereignty? It doesn't exist.

So I guess we are all Americans now right Trudeau?

[The_Squid]

What treaties? Are the Americans even signed on to the same treaties? I suspect you may be jumping the gun about the countries involved, since the Americans have legalized pot in their own country. Clearly, either the treaty can be ignored, or America is not party to it.

The article should have at least mentioned what the treaties were, if not linked to them.

You are speculating without knowing those details I mentioned.

Edited January 5, 2016 by Charles Anthony
excessive quoting; [OP]

[dialamah]

That sucks. And really, he and/or his advisors ought to have known this already. But I wonder which countries we have these treaties with, is it just the US? The story doesn't specify. And if the individual States can legalize pot, maybe individual provinces can as well.

[Derek 2.0]

I suspect you may be jumping the gun about the countries involved

My thoughts exactly...........

[G Huxley]

Hey Trudeau why don't you ask the Dutch, Uruguay, Portugal, Spain, Czech Republic and others how it's done?

Or was this one of the carrots your handlers down south offered you?

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/is-justin-trudeau-getting-the-coveted-opening-address-at-davos-at-the-world-economic-forum

Squid I'm not speculating on anything that was the article and Trudeau.

There is some UN anti drug treaty if I remember correctly that was pushed forth by Nelson Rockefeller (Nixon's vp) which includes cannabis as an internationally banned substance. I think it's that that he's referring to. Well lots of countries haven't fallen for such bullying. This already shows the fiber and trustworthiness of Trudeau.

Edited January 5, 2016 by G Huxley

[Derek 2.0]

And if the individual States can legalize pot, maybe individual provinces can as well.

Or he just decriminalizes it.......

[Accountability Now]

since the Americans have legalized pot in their own country.

Actually, pot is still technically illegal in the USA however the States are allowed to decide if they want to legalize it for their area.

The use, possession, sale, cultivation, and transportation of cannabis (marijuana) in the United States under federal law is illegal but the federal government has announced that if a state wants to pass a law to decriminalize cannabis for recreational or medical use they can do so, but they need to have a regulation system in place for cannabis. Cannabis is listed as a Schedule I substance under the Controlled Substances Act of 1970, the highest classification under the legislation. This means that the substance has been claimed by the U.S. federal government to have both high abuse potential and no established medical use.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_cannabis_by_U.S._jurisdiction

I'm not picking this out to be nitpicky but wondering if the US can side step these same treaty regulations by this technicality.

[G Huxley]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_Convention_on_Narcotic_Drugs#List_of_controlled_narcotic_drugs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convention_on_Psychotropic_Substances

(He could get around this technicality: Cannabis is defined in this treaty by the UN as a narcotic, but cannabis isn't a narcotic.)

Edited January 5, 2016 by G Huxley

[G Huxley]

Squid the American govt still has cannabis illegal. The American State govts are the ones who have legalized it. There is a difference. I mentioned the American govt.

[TimG]

The Netherlands is a party to the 1961 Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs, the 1971 Convention on Psychotropic Substances, and the 1988 United Nations Convention Against Illicit Traffic in Narcotic Drugs and Psychotropic Substances. The 1961 convention prohibits cultivation and trade of naturally-occurring drugs such as cannabis; the 1971 treaty bans the manufacture and trafficking of synthetic drugs such as barbiturates and amphetamines; and the 1988 convention requires states to criminalize illicit drug possession:

...

The Dutch policy of keeping anti-drug laws on the books while limiting enforcement of certain offenses is carefully designed to reduce harm while still complying with the letter of international drug control treaties. This is necessary in order to avoid criticism from the International Narcotics Board, which historically has taken a dim view of any moves to relax official drug policy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_the_Netherlands

[dialamah]

Here's a news story with more information. Nowhere does it say JT has given up the idea, only that it will take some maneuvering to achieve. Might be a little premature to assume JT lacks fiber and trustworthiness on this issue, at least.

Mendes said Canada could still find a way to adhere to the treaties, but will have to show that legalizing marijuana helps reduce illicit drug use.

“There’s no international treaty where you cannot make reservations,” he said.

“The problem is the government having to explain why it’s doing it, why it feels it has to do it, given the conviction (with which) Prime Minister Trudeau has said it’s a failure in terms of enforcement … in almost every respect and is driving up the crime rate in some parts of Canada.”

[Derek 2.0]

Here's a news story with more information. Nowhere does it say JT has given up the idea, only that it will take some maneuvering to achieve. Might be a little premature to assume JT lacks fiber and trustworthiness on this issue, at least.

Interesting. It would seem to me the way forward is to just decriminalize it, like the NDP proposed.

[dialamah]

Interesting. It would seem to me the way forward is to just decriminalize it, like the NDP proposed.

Could be. I sure do look forward to a day when various parties have to work together to succeed, instead of constant partisan sniping. I suspect that's doomed to remain a fantasy, though.

[The_Squid]

Decriminalizing would be one way, possibly.

However, I think G Huxley is still jumping the gun. This is a memo to the PM outlining treaty obligations. It doesn't mean there is no way around it or that the gov't won't move to skirt the treaty to keep their promise.

The criticism is a tad early.

[Derek 2.0]

Could be. I sure do look forward to a day when various parties have to work together to succeed, instead of constant partisan sniping. I suspect that's doomed to remain a fantasy, though.

And I look forward to when the various parties don't promise pie in the sky

[G Huxley]

How about just legalize it and say f^ck the UN's outdated fascistic treaty?

[The_Squid]

K

How about just legalize it and say f^ck the UN's outdated fascistic treaty?

Because Canada is a signatory and it could have other ramifications. You don't just snap your fingers and legislation appears out of the sky.

This is what the Conservatives did for years, and look at all the ill-considered legislation and unconstitutional laws that were overturned by the SCC... I would rather they take the time to get it right.

[ReeferMadness]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-legalizing-pot-global-treaties-1.3390745

How predictable. Wasn't it obvious that this was coming? Big brother America told Trudeau he wasn't allowed to do anything they didn't want him to do. National sovereignty? It doesn't exist.

So I guess we are all Americans now right Trudeau?

Calm down. Trudeau's been PM less than 3 months. The media is looking for controversy and they've found an internal memo that outlines some treaties that previous governments have signed onto. Then they went and found themselves an expert who is willing to say it's a big problem. There is no statement from the government so I see this as nothing but speculation.

[Smallc]

Hey Trudeau why don't you ask the Dutch, Uruguay, Portugal, Spain, Czech Republic and others how it's done?

I don't think he wrote the article.

[Smallc]

And if the individual States can legalize pot, maybe individual provinces can as well.

In Canada, the criminal law is the exclusive jurisdiction of the federal government. Not so south of the border (though marijuana is still technically illegal throughout the entire US, per federal law).

[Smallc]

Interesting. It would seem to me the way forward is to just decriminalize it, like the NDP proposed.

That's a half measure that leaves the profit in the hands of organized crime. Pull out of the treaties.

[ReeferMadness]

That's a half measure that leaves the profit in the hands of organized crime. Pull out of the treaties.

Depends on how the treaties are written. If they're about discouraging marijuana use, it can be argued that is better done via regulation (particularly among underage people)

[Smallc]

Depends on how the treaties are written. If they're about discouraging marijuana use, it can be argued that is better done via regulation (particularly among underage people)

Somehow, I doubt that.

[Smallc]

Depends on how the treaties are written. If they're about discouraging marijuana use, it can be argued that is better done via regulation (particularly among underage people)

From the CBC article in the OP:

The Liberal policy means that Canada will have to amend its participation in three international conventions:

— The Single Convention on Narcotic Drugs of 1961, as amended by the 1972 Protocol;

— The Convention on Psychotropic Substances of 1971;

— The United Nations Convention against Illicit Traffic in Narcotic Drugs and Psychotropic Substances of 1988.

"All three require the criminalization of possession and production of cannabis," says the briefing note.

[Smallc]

I've always thought that the world and Canada was generally wrong on three things; the right to die, marijuana, and prostitution. The Liberals have a chance to fix at least two of those wrongs within this mandate. One will most definitely be fixed, given the federal position on the new Quebec right to die laws (they basically said, good idea)....I'm not so confident that the others will end up as well.