Bryan Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 If we don't have enough hard evidence to arrest someone who clearly has been radicalized - but enough circumstantial evidence to represent a potential threat - do you think some legislation could be developed to allow judicial application for a tracking bracelet/anklet to be worn so at least we can keep track of these guys and not have to follow them around 7/24? We need to identify these mosques that support and or foster extremism, and treat them as criminal organizations like is sometimes done for the mafia or biker gangs -- just being known to associate with them is a crime all by itself, so they are subject to arrest at any time for no probable cause for any other criminal act. Quote
Black Dog Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 We need to identify these mosques that support and or foster extremism, and treat them as criminal organizations like is sometimes done for the mafia or biker gangs -- just being known to associate with them is a crime all by itself, so they are subject to arrest at any time for no probable cause for any other criminal act. Garbage and anti-democratic. Why do you hate our freedoms? Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 It was good enough for PM Trudeau during the "October Crisis". Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Big Guy Posted October 23, 2014 Author Report Posted October 23, 2014 (edited) In October of 1970, Canadians (FLQ) were planting bombs in mail boxes, had kidnapped and killed a member of the cabinet and were threatening more harm. I remember how I felt when I got on to the subway trains in Toronto after there were warnings that Toronto subways would be targeted. Terrorism is nothing new for Canada. There will always be young Canadians who for their particular passionate cause, are ready to kill and die for that cause. These last two events were suicide trips. I do not believe that either one of these individuals had an escape strategy. It unfortunate that neither or both survived. I think we might learn from what reasons they were prepared to die and how their causes became that important to them. The will be all kinds of speculation as to their causes depending on the agenda of the speculators. Too bad. At least in the FLQ we knew the cause and the PM at the time thought it warranted passing the "War Measures Act". Many people thought that it was a gross overreaction. I hope we do not overreact on this one. Edited October 23, 2014 by Big Guy Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Argus Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 Happened already. Less of a deal was made of it than this. No one was killed or shot then - on live tv no less. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 We also have men and women in uniform attacking people. Who are they attacking? Foreign radicals. So why should any Canadian want to attack them here in Canada? The issue is that some Muslims consider themselves Muslims first and Canadians a very, very distant second. In a fight between us and their fellow Muslims they choose their fellow Muslims, people they've never met and can't even understand since they don't speak the same language. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
cybercoma Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 No one was killed or shot then - on live tv no less. No, but people are shot and killed everyday with less fanfare. In the previous incident, someone broke into the Prime Minister's residence in an attempt to assassinate him. That's a big f'ing deal. In 1966 (or was it 68?), someone tried to blow up the government benches in parliament. This situation is relatively tame by comparison and people seem to be losing their minds over it. Quote
cybercoma Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 The issue is that some Muslims consider themselves Muslims first and Canadians a very, very distant second. Got that Orange Lodge membership up to date? I seem to remember you making this exactly same argument back in the 1800s about the Catholics. Quote
dre Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 (edited) Who are they attacking? Foreign radicals. So why should any Canadian want to attack them here in Canada? The issue is that some Muslims consider themselves Muslims first and Canadians a very, very distant second. In a fight between us and their fellow Muslims they choose their fellow Muslims, people they've never met and can't even understand since they don't speak the same language. Not everyone has the same opinion you do of the people we are attacking. A lot of muslims see us as trying to stop an attempt by Sunnis to not be ruled by Assad or Iran. Not to mention we are allowing ourselves to be associated with countries that have gotten hundreds of thousands of people killed over there. We have inadvertantly waded into an ugly sectarian war. The reality is if we are going to have an interventionalist foreign policy then we are going to have these kinds of problems here at home more and more. These policies put us in danger. Edited October 23, 2014 by dre Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
Keepitsimple Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 Not everyone has the same opinion you do of the people we are attacking. A lot of muslims see us as trying to stop an attempt by Sunnis to not be ruled by Assad or Iran. Not to mention we are allowing ourselves to be associated with countries that have gotten hundreds of thousands of people killed over there. The reality is if we are going to have an interventionalist foreign policy then we are going to have these kinds of problems here at home more and more. So you're saying that if we had just stayed out of everything.....our radicalized Canadians would go overseas to fight - then come back and not be a threat here - because we are nice guys? Is that your theory? Quote Back to Basics
guyser Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 We need to identify these mosques that support and or foster extremism, and treat them as criminal organizations like is sometimes done for the mafia or biker gangs -- just being known to associate with them is a crime all by itself, so they are subject to arrest at any time for no probable cause for any other criminal act. Quote
Big Guy Posted October 23, 2014 Author Report Posted October 23, 2014 One thing in common for both these killers was they wanted to leave Canada and were prevented from doing so. Why? I thought that the old East Germany was the only country that would not let you leave. (Maybe Gaza is another). If a person wants to leave then great! Goodbye! Then the minute they leave we flag their passport for if/when they want back in. Then we screen them accordingly. Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
guyser Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 One thing in common for both these killers was they wanted to leave Canada and were prevented from doing so.No they werent. The airlines prevented them . Any of these two could very well have jumped ijn the ocean and started out. Could have rented a boat and left. COuld have waited for winter to kick in and walked. Lotsa options, only thing is, they are a bunch of pussies. If a person wants to leave then great! Goodbye! Then the minute they leave we flag their passport for if/when they want back in. Then we screen them accordingly.If born and bred here, as those two were.....ask them Q's at the border is fine, but no matter what they say they are getting in. Pure and simple. Quote
Big Guy Posted October 23, 2014 Author Report Posted October 23, 2014 No they werent. The airlines prevented them . Any of these two could very well have jumped ijn the ocean and started out. Could have rented a boat and left. COuld have waited for winter to kick in and walked. Lotsa options, only thing is, they are a bunch of pussies. If born and bred here, as those two were.....ask them Q's at the border is fine, but no matter what they say they are getting in. Pure and simple. Are you sure for what reasons they were prevented from leaving? As then coming back, they would have to show their passports and then answer questions as to where they have been and what they have been doing (because their passports had been red flagged). The fact that they fought in a war against Canadian forces would deny them entry. What about the Canadians who leave Canada to fight on the side of the Kurds against Isis in Syria? Should they be allowed back in? What if they fought for the Kurds against Turkey in Turkey? What if they fought for one of those militias in Libya? or Yemen? Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
guyser Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 Are you sure for what reasons they were prevented from leaving?Pretty much, yes. As then coming back, they would have to show their passports and then answer questions as to where they have been and what they have been doing (because their passports had been red flagged). The fact that they fought in a war against Canadian forces would deny them entry.No it wouldnt, as they are opening the door to enter, they would be asking him questions. No matter what, they HAVE to let them in. What about the Canadians who leave Canada to fight on the side of the Kurds against Isis in Syria? Should they be allowed back in? What if they fought for the Kurds against Turkey in Turkey? What if they fought for one of those militias in Libya? or Yemen?Yes. Its the law, they have to let them in. Why would one think otherwise? Quote
dre Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 So you're saying that if we had just stayed out of everything.....our radicalized Canadians would go overseas to fight - then come back and not be a threat here - because we are nice guys? Is that your theory? Its not a coincidence I dont think that these attacks started happening within weeks of us flying over a foreign country bombing muslims. The more we involve ourselves in the middle east the more likely we are to be targetted. And its not my theory... western intelligence agencies have been warning us about this for decades. And this is even more dangerous because we will be seen by many as fighting on behalf of the Assad regime in Syria, and the Iranian Proxy that government Iraq. This is going to make a lot of people very angry including quite a few of Canadas million muslims. Its extremely stupid what we are allowing our government to do. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
Bonam Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 No it wouldnt, as they are opening the door to enter, they would be asking him questions. No matter what, they HAVE to let them in. Let them in and then send them straight to jail. That's fine. Quote
Bonam Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 This is going to make a lot of people very angry including quite a few of Canadas million muslims. Which is one of many reasons it was dumb to import a million Muslims into Canada to begin with. Quote
guyser Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 Let them in and then send them straight to jail. That's fine.You forgot...'with evidence' . Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 Actually, a majority of Canadians support military and humanitarian actions against ISIS....even some Muslims ! Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Big Guy Posted October 23, 2014 Author Report Posted October 23, 2014 Which is one of many reasons it was dumb to import a million Muslims into Canada to begin with. Well, if we had done that then the Toronto maple Leafs would be a lot weaker and we would have missed out on the participation and benefits to Canada of a large number of people; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Canadian_Muslims Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
guyser Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 Which is one of many reasons it was dumb to import a million Muslims into Canada to begin with.Phew...good thing Canada didnt. Quote
Bonam Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 Well, if we had done that then the Toronto maple Leafs would be a lot weaker and we would have missed out on the participation and benefits to Canada of a large number of people; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Canadian_Muslims 1. I couldn't possibly care less about the "Toronto Maple Leafs", seriously 2. There are plenty of immigrants from all parts of the world waiting to get into Canada, we could have still let in just as many people Quote
dre Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 Which is one of many reasons it was dumb to import a million Muslims into Canada to begin with. To do that you have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that they commited some kind of crime... And personally I dont give a rats ass if Canadians go and fight against the Assad regime, or the Iranian proxy that runs Iraq for that matter. Let em go, fight, and come back. Our mistake here was allowing our face to be put on a war thats goal is to keep 20 million sunnis living under a brutal dictator. I think THAT is why these attacks are happening... our government put us in the crosshairs. Its not because we have some muslims that want to go and fight for causes in the middle east. I think people have been going over there to fight for years... who cares. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
bush_cheney2004 Posted October 23, 2014 Report Posted October 23, 2014 We took one off your hands after he attempted to blow up LAX...he rots in a U.S. federal prison. In Canada, he would be back on the street. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
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