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This week in Islam


kimmy

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Tunisia is the closest to what could be called a success story of the Arab Spring.   Although there are struggles and setbacks, the country seems determined to work toward freedom and democracy, based on the example set by the US.   Some excerpts from an interview with Meherzia Labidi , a female elected to Tunisia's Parliament.    

Tunisia's government is focused on using the best principles of the Islamic religion and developing a state where everyone is equally valued.

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"Ennahda (political party) doesn't tell Tunisians how to be good Muslims," said Labidi. "We are not a party telling people what to eat, what to dress or how to pray."

Instead, she explained, "we are a party that takes inspiration from Islamic values. And these values meet universal values — justice, solidarity, respect of human dignity, liberty." They don't seek theocracy, but a "civil state" where the differences between Islamists and secularists can be bridged and reconciled in a stable, pluralist democracy.

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"We had confrontation, we had polarization. We were struck by terrorism," she said. "But we had political leaders who are visionary and audacious, who risked dialogue, instead of going to the dynamic of confrontation."

 
 
 
 

As one of the leaders of the group tasked with developing Tunisia's constitution, Labidi says:

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"One of the first documents we had on the table, translated from English to Arabic, was the American constitution," she said. 

 
 
 

 

She believes there is a lasting legacy from the Arab Spring, despite disappointments and setbacks, such as Sisi's coup in Egypt.

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 "We have changed from the era of accepting dictatorship to another era of acting, of saying listen to us," she said. "There is something irreversible in the minds of Arab populations. We have chosen freedom."

 
 

And the United States is still a role model for achieving freedom and democracy in their country.  

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Labidi said, she still sees the United States as a source of inspiration. "I don't believe America will give up supporting democracies," she said. "No, not even if someone applies the brakes for a while. There is something special about this country."

 

 

I hope Tunisia can continue their journey toward a free society and become an example and a beacon for other Arabs and Arab countries.   

 

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On 2017-02-05 at 0:42 PM, Argus said:

The difference is not that there are laws against it and that they're enforced. The difference is that kind of behaviour is unacceptable in our culture. Even young men get that, except when they're particularly drunk or stupid.

I think the cultural values come first, then protected by laws. In other cultures, such as some in Africa and the Middle East, they either don't think it's a big deal to abuse women or they simply don't care. It is definitely this culture that needs to be annihilated.

Edited by OftenWrong
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On 1/10/2017 at 2:02 PM, eyeball said:

So if the war is being prosecuted by a democratically elected government then why shouldn't the people who voted for that government be considered legitimate targets?

How do terrorists/freedom-fighters tell us voters apart if we don't wear uniforms? 

 guess you'll have to stay hidden in your tree, so you'll won't be mistaken for a voter....

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If a country chooses to ban a group of certain religion, they have the right to do that.

Just like companies have the right to hire and fire who they want, countries should be allowed to do the same.

Religion is also something personal so it has absolutely NO PLACE in a way a country sets it's laws and rules.

If a country chooses to ban a certain religion, they should have the right to do that.

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13 minutes ago, AlexBoyKing said:

If a country chooses to ban a group of certain religion, they have the right to do that.

Just like companies have the right to hire and fire who they want, countries should be allowed to do the same.

Religion is also something personal so it has absolutely NO PLACE in a way a country sets it's laws and rules.

If a country chooses to ban a certain religion, they should have the right to do that.

I fully agree with sentence # 3.

The others, not so much.

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This week in Islam we get a pretty clear and brutal idea of the wildly differing cultural values of Canada vs that of Afghanistan and similar Muslim countries. A huge armed mob surrounded a police station in Afghanistan, shooting several police in order to take away two prisoners who had recently been arrested and kill them. Their crime? Murder? Child rape? Nope. Adultery.

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/world/mob-kills-eloped-lovers-after-storming-afghan-police-station

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

We have to really take a few steps back and look at all this in a new perspective. This has all been a huge charade not unlike the commie scares of last century, still resurrected by dinosaur reporters and throwback oldies from the past. 

The stunning revelation that the NIST WTC7 study was a farce, a coverup for much more serious coverups that go back to before 9-11. 

Can anyone explain to me why the "worst of the worst" after 911, the Taliban, were active partners with the US government and various US energy companies? Why were these folks "from the latter 1990s US supported and organized, our buddies, but post 911" they became vicious tyrants, the devil incarnate, all the other propaganda we see on these pages".

Why were the vicious Taliban being wined and dined in the US, taken on tours to Mt Rushmore, paid huge sums as bribes to get various concessions for US energy and mining companies. It's Iraq, Indonesia, ... redux. 

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Just saw it on the news today:

 

 

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Eight Iraqis guilty of gang-raping German tourist in Austria

VIENNA — An Austrian court found eight Iraqi nationals guilty on Thursday of gang-raping a German tourist on New Year’s Eve more than a year ago and sentenced them to prison terms of between nine and 13 years.

 

http://www.torontosun.com/2017/03/02/eight-iraqis-guilty-of-gang-raping-german-tourist-in-austria

 

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An online commercial released by Nike (NKE.N) this week that showed Arab women fencing, boxing and spinning on ice-skates has stirred controversy over its attempt to smash stereotypes about women leading home-bound lives in the conservative region.

It begins with a woman nervously peering out of her doorway and adjusting her veil before going for a run in the street, while a female voice narrates in a Saudi dialect: "What will they say about you? Maybe they'll say you exceeded all expectations."

.....snip.....

Women exercising in public is a rare sight in much of the region and women-only gyms are few, are not fully equipped for different sports and are often more expensive than gyms for men.

In Saudi Arabia, physical education is prohibited in all-girls public schools and women's gyms remain illegal in the kingdom because female athleticism is deemed un-Islamic.

http://in.reuters.com/article/us-arab-women-nike-idINKBN1620I7

I guess the kingdom has not yet discovered that exercise can be beneficial not only for males, but for females also. Facilitate conditions for men to become healthy and expose women to heart attacks.

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1 minute ago, capricorn said:

http://in.reuters.com/article/us-arab-women-nike-idINKBN1620I7

I guess the kingdom has not yet discovered that exercise can be beneficial not only for males, but for females also. Facilitate conditions for men to become healthy and expose women to heart attacks.

 

The Greatest Country In the World...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrCeCS_kNLI

 

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At what point can you look at a group and claim that they accept or even "like" something?  For example, how many hockey fans have to accept or like fighting for us to say "hockey fans accept fighting as part of the sport"...50%...60%?  When I see 15,000 stand and cheer a fight at a hockey game, I would be comfortable saying that "hockey fans accept or even like fighting in the game.   

In the case of Islam, when you see stats that show high 80% or even 90% acceptance of certain ideas, I'd say that a high enough number of Muslim acceptance of stoning, hatred of homos, rape, misogyny, FGM, hatred of western beliefs etc. that I can comfortably claim that "muslims have a stone age backward philosophy".   

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24 minutes ago, Goddess said:

I don't understand how there can be so much of this going on in the world, when according to some here, there are only about a half dozen "bad apples" in the religion.

Saudi is a terrible place, that's for sure, and many other places in the Middle East and Africa aren't much better.

Its also true that what a government does is not necessarily supported by all of the populace. In oppressive countries people who object are subject to sometimes severe penalties, so most objectors or non-believers will hide in conformity.  Some people will activate and risk jail time or death and of course some really do believe.  Assuming that what an oppressive regime determines as law is automatically wholeheartedly endorsed by its citizenry is a mistake that a lot of people seem to make.  Myself included at times.  

Specifically in regards to violent extremism, its estimated that approximately 106,000 or .006625% of all 1.6 billion Muslims are actively involved.  106,000 people sounds like a lot, but compared to the larger group, its pretty small.   

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1 minute ago, dialamah said:

Saudi is a terrible place, that's for sure, and many other places in the Middle East and Africa aren't much better.

 

Where is Islam practiced and to be admired?

Surely there is ONE country that is dominated by Islam that isn't a sh*t hole.

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1 minute ago, dialamah said:

Saudi is a terrible place, that's for sure,

Saudi Arabia is also one of our BFF's that we support with arms.

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Its also true that what a government does is not necessarily supported by all of the populace.

It doesn't matter if we don't support our government we're still just as responsible for it's actions.

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2 minutes ago, Hal 9000 said:

At what point can you look at a group and claim that they accept or even "like" something?  For example, how many hockey fans have to accept or like fighting for us to say "hockey fans accept fighting as part of the sport"...50%...60%?  When I see 15,000 stand and cheer a fight at a hockey game, I would be comfortable saying that "hockey fans accept or even like fighting in the game.   

In the case of Islam, when you see stats that show high 80% or even 90% acceptance of certain ideas, I'd say that a high enough number of Muslim acceptance of stoning, hatred of homos, rape, misogyny, FGM, hatred of western beliefs etc. that I can comfortably claim that "muslims have a stone age backward philosophy".   

I'm just reading "Islam and the Future of Tolerance" by Sam Harris and Maajid Nawaz.

Nawaz describes the variety of lines of thought amongst Islamists, and outlines what he's doing to combat it.

I'm not finished it yet, but it's interesting so far, a different perspective, coming from a Muslim trying to reform AND change the backward thinking of so-called moderate Muslims at the same time, which he feels is essential - he feels the religion needs reforming AND that moderates need to stop the backwards thinking - both at the same time.

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8 minutes ago, dialamah said:

 

Specifically in regards to violent extremism, its estimated that approximately 106,000 or .006625% of all 1.6 billion Muslims are actively involved.  106,000 people sounds like a lot, but compared to the larger group, its pretty small.   

In the book I'm reading right now, (see my above comment to Hal) Nawaz estimates that 25% of Muslims worldwide agree with violent jihad and that we shouldn't expect much help from "conservative Muslims", since they do not agree with the violent jihad, but will fully support and fight against any gender equality, etc.

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4 minutes ago, Goddess said:

I'm just reading "Islam and the Future of Tolerance" by Sam Harris and Maajid Nawaz.

Nawaz describes the variety of lines of thought amongst Islamists, and outlines what he's doing to combat it.

I'm not finished it yet, but it's interesting so far, a different perspective, coming from a Muslim trying to reform AND change the backward thinking of so-called moderate Muslims at the same time, which he feels is essential - he feels the religion needs reforming AND that moderates need to stop the backwards thinking - both at the same time.

I've been reading stuff from theexmuslim.org.   I agree reform is in order but don't agree that calling people names like 'rat Muslims' is going to lead to reform.

If our government had any moral balls, they'd refuse to do business with countries like Saudi or even iffy places like Egypt.  Places like Tunisia should have more international support, imo.

 

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19 minutes ago, DogOnPorch said:

Where is Islam practiced and to be admired?

Surely there is ONE country that is dominated by Islam that isn't a sh*t hole.

I've often asked for which of the 57 odd Muslim countries believe in equal rights for men and women, for Muslims and non-Muslims, and don't have religious violence. I get no answers.

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3 minutes ago, dialamah said:

I've been reading stuff from theexmuslim.org.   I agree reform is in order but don't agree that calling people names like 'rat Muslims' is going to lead to reform.

If our government had any moral balls, they'd refuse to do business with countries like Saudi or even iffy places like Egypt.  Places like Tunisia should have more international support, imo.

 

 

So any thoughts on what country a greasy Islamophobe can look to in order to see Islam practiced as the peaceful humanitarian religion of love and peace n' love n' equality n' etc?

2 minutes ago, Argus said:

I've often asked for which of the 57 odd Muslim countries believe in equal rights for men and women, for Muslims and non-Muslims, and don't have religious violence. I get no answers.

We know the answer...will dialamah have to lie? Or simply evade?

Let's watch n' see...

Edited by DogOnPorch
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