Another day, another international embarrassment for Canada

[hitops]

I'm proud that Canada is willing to stand with Israel despite it not being popular. They are THE only democratic, civilized and modern country in the entire middle east. Actually they are downright socialist in many ways.

The big difference between Israel and other socialist-style countries of the west, is that Israel is the only one who is surrounded by neighbors who want to destroy them. Hence, their foreign policy is a little different than those of us who live in countries that are not full of people bent on killing us because of difference in religion.

We should stand with secular democracies, not with third-world hovels who still can't even guarantee the same rights to women much less any other group.

Beating your wife silly is a legitimate disciplinary strategy in the countries that hate Israel. If you are supporting those countries, understand the culture you are supporting. Israel is literally centuries ahead on basically every social issue.

Hamas is not interested in peace, it wants to destroy Israel on principle, not because of any land issues. Same for hezbollah. If a peaceful solution is found that allows Palestinians to achieve stability and prosperity, that would undercut the entire narrative that those groups need to survive. Peace is a direct threat to them, and they will never want it.

Edited April 13, 2013 by hitops

[eyeball]

To bad we didn't stand with Iran in 1953, the ME would probably be almost all democratized by now.

BTW anyone else notice that Israel has no oil?

Funny dat.

Edited April 13, 2013 by eyeball

[hitops]

To bad we didn't stand with Iran in 1953, the ME would probably be almost all democratized by now.

BTW anyone else notice that Israel has no oil?

Funny dat.

Iran wasn't a democracy in 1953, or any other time. We should stand with democracies.

[Mighty AC]

That's a ludicrous claim on so many levels. #1, I'm not a Conservative, and I "love" (ie: support) Israel. Which brings me to #2, which is "supportive of Israel" doesn't translate to supporting all of their actions.

I was really referring to conservative politicians not you personally. I don't understand the unconditional love they give to Israel.

[The_Squid]

Iran wasn't a democracy in 1953, or any other time. We should stand with democracies.

Are you sure about that? Yo need a history lesson....

It was Washington that orchestrated the 1953 coup to topple Iran’s democratically elected government, the first in the Middle East, and install the compliant shah in power.

https://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/06/22-0

[Signals.Cpl]

To bad we didn't stand with Iran in 1953, the ME would probably be almost all democratized by now.

BTW anyone else notice that Israel has no oil?

Funny dat.

Putting the events in Iran during 1953 aside, the Middle East was guaranteed to fail as a region when it comes to democracy, economy or society in 1918 rather than any time after.

[hitops]

Are you sure about that? Yo need a history lesson....

https://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/06/22-0

I'm not in a need of a history lesson. Iran was not a democracy. Hitler was democratically elected too.

[eyeball]

Putting the events in Iran during 1953 aside, the Middle East was guaranteed to fail as a region when it comes to democracy, economy or society in 1918 rather than any time after.

Not necessarily, we definitely planted some seeds of destruction in 1918 but we could have stopped cultivating them any time we wanted.

In the meantime there can be no doubt that in 1953 the west killed the closest thing to democracy the Muslim Middle East has ever seen in what was arguably the single greatest foreign policy blunder the west has ever engineered, bar none.

[jbg]

Firstly, isn't the controversy surrounding this situation the fact that some fear the location of the meeting could be construed as defacto acceptance of Israel's claim to that territory?

And it often appears to me that Israel is as inflexible on its demands for peace terms as any other player in the region. Israel is imperialistic.

I think the issue of the territory is a phony one. While Araby held East Jerusalem they were not willing to accept Israel during the "pre-1967" era. What makes that time now a golden age?

[jbg]

Imagine the furor if the Assembly of First Nations held their annual meeting in Caledonia.

I imagine they could book an assembly hall there the same way a wedding party could.

[Charon]

Its obvious the ones here who have never been there. Too much circle jerking with the propaganda. The reality is quite different on the ground. I'll bet most racists against Palestinians have never met one.

Edited April 14, 2013 by Charon

[eyeball]

I imagine they could book an assembly hall there the same way a wedding party could.

I suppose they could. The controversy would nonetheless pretty much deliberately inflame the same sorts of passions Baird's choice of location has for the very same reason.

It would be rightly viewed as an act of divisive shit disturbing for pettiness sake that only makes things worse.

[jbg]

I suppose they could. The controversy would nonetheless pretty much deliberately inflame the same sorts of passions Baird's choice of location has for the very same reason.

It would be rightly viewed as an act of divisive shit disturbing for pettiness sake that only makes things worse.

Do you really think that white Canadians would go off on a murderous rampage if such a rental were made? Remember Sharon's Temple Mount walk supposedly triggered the Second Intifada. Would such an assembly hall rental even trigger this kind of a thread?

I doubt it.

[eyeball]

I doubt it would start a murderous rage too but it would definitely start this kind of a thread. I'd put money on it.

[Guest American Woman]

For the record, there was no "rental" involved here. Baird met with the Israeli minister of justice for coffee in her office.

[hitops]

I suppose they could. The controversy would nonetheless pretty much deliberately inflame the same sorts of passions Baird's choice of location has for the very same reason.

It would be rightly viewed as an act of divisive shit disturbing for pettiness sake that only makes things worse.

Not likely. Who cares? Let them book their meeting anywhere they want, just like everyone else.

[Bugs]

The potential problem is that, by meeting in Jerusalem, there might be some slight hint that Canada recognizes that Jersusalem is the legitimate capital of Israel. Stress should be put on the word 'hint'.

Joe Clark, in his brief and ill-fated stint as PM, agreed to put the Canadian embassy in Jerusalem, which caused quite a stink. Nobody ever said Clark was too bright.

This case isn't like that. It's certainly not an embarassment. It may not even qualify as a 'signal' of where Canada stands on the issue. Who in the Moslem world cares about whatever signals Canada sends, anyway?

[roy baty]

Embarrassment? Anyone who doesn't tout the progressive banner internationally is an embarrassment to the lefties! Got to love the the OP. Hudson posts and then flies away back to his left wing camp.

We all saw what happened to the Jews the last time no one stood in their corner... Kudos to Baird and this government for actually having the guts to actually take a stance and support a loyal ally.

[ReeferMadness]

Or the palestines are a bunch of idiots for letting thier arab friends use them as pawns. Israel would love peace, but does hama, hezbolla, iran, egypt and so on. Why does'nt palestine take what they have right now and start building a country (like Israel) instead of wallowing in thier own shit whinning about it. Israel did not, they built a country out of the same rock. They should have taken that last deal arafat squandered. it would have been a great start and they would be better off today for it. And the hudsons of the world better look at the other side of the story instead of just what his professor has to say.

Israel would love peace if it gets to dictate the terms. At the moment, it's building settlements on stolen land.

[shortlived]

eyeball, on 13 Apr 2013 - 16:23, said:

To bad we didn't stand with Iran in 1953, the ME would probably be almost all democratized by now.

BTW anyone else notice that Israel has no oil?

Funny dat.

This isn't true, Israel has offshore oil reserves shared with Turkey as well as oil in the south of Israel.

http://geology.com/usgs/oil-shale/images/israel-jordan-oil-shale-map.gif

Now contrast that with

http://www.honestreporting.ca/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/regionMap.jpg

Edited April 15, 2013 by shortlived

[Archanfel]

So people are angry with Isarel for building a few settlements, whereas Canada is building office towers in a city called Toronto. Ironic, isn't it? In fact, while there are plenty of evidences that Israelis lived in the city of peace thousands of years ago, is there any evidence that it was the Europeans who first settled in Canada?

The history of the world is not people making friends. You had better weapons, and you massacred them. End of story.

[hitops]

So people are angry with Isarel for building a few settlements, whereas Canada is building office towers in a city called Toronto. Ironic, isn't it? In fact, while there are plenty of evidences that Israelis lived in the city of peace thousands of years ago, is there any evidence that it was the Europeans who first settled in Canada?

The history of the world is not people making friends. You had better weapons, and you massacred them. End of story.

Well before the natives peoples made it to North America, there were only animals here. Maybe we should just ship everyone out and leave it as it's true original state as a nature reserve?

Ok but we'll accept they are just animals. Now we have to carefully track every little tribal war and massacre that took place over thousands of years before Europeans arrived, all land exchanged, restitutions need to be paid etc. Cause we need to restore everything to it's 2000 BC state. Canada, looking foward!

Edited April 15, 2013 by hitops

[PIK]

And I have read the natives is a offspring of a earlier migration of european people.

[g_bambino]

So people are angry with Isarel for building a few settlements, whereas Canada is building office towers in a city called Toronto. Ironic, isn't it?

Um, can you point to the agreements and treaties between the president (is he the equivalent of our crown?) and any Palestinians?

[PIK]

Israel would love peace if it gets to dictate the terms. At the moment, it's building settlements on stolen land.

I agree about building settlements at this time. But then constantly shooting mortors over the border does not help either.