Time for a Little Political Incorrectness

[LonJowett]

Why, oh why, do you insist on suspending the operation of common sense?

Why was one Jew too many, when in general Jews are productive members of the community, yet we insist on absorbing huge numbers of Jamaicans (generally not Muslims), Somalis, Pakistanis and others who, as a group, don't assimilate?

As a Jew, I find this extremely distasteful. It's nothing but hate speech.

[jbg]

As a Jew, I find this extremely distasteful. It's nothing but hate speech.

Hate speech? No, if you're really Jewish, you're self-hating.

[dre]

Hate speech? No, if you're really Jewish, you're self-hating.

[CANADIEN]

From what I gather, the OLA was incorporated into the Charter of Selective Rights and Fickle Freedoms.

From your own choice of words, about anyone can gather you don't know what you're talking about. The OLA is not part of the charter, not part of the Constitution. To claim otherwise would be like saying that the National Voter Registration Act is part of the U.S. Constitution.

[CANADIEN]

Why was one Jew too many, jbg? One was too many in the eye of people who held the same views about Jews (actually worse) that you hold today about other groups.

[CANADIEN]

While the term "hate speech" is shall we say a bit over the top here, I find it interesting that Jews who fail to be bigoted and ignorant must be self-hating.

[Army Guy]

Thank you for reminding me of something I already know about, the FEDERAL Official Language Act.

Actually i was responding to your comment below,

Today, while the term "official" is not used, one doesn't need to see that word to realize that the status of English in most provinces is akin to that of a sole official language.

And in most cases you are right,english is the prime language, but it does not take away from the fact that the province is following the official language act. Signifcant Demand as laid out in the offical Language act lays out the guide lines for each province to follow.

For example, Section 20 of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms guarantees the right of the Canadian public to communicate in English and French with any central government office or with regional offices where there is "a significant demand for communication with and services from that office." Significant demand is not defined in the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. One of the purposes of the Official Languages Act of 1988 was to remedy this omission.

feel free to show me the bilingual policies of the Governments of Ontario and British Columbia.

One of the first areas addressed by the Ontario government was lawmaking . In 1970, the House Rules were amended to allow the use of French in the provincial parliament. Under section 13 of the House Rules, francophone members are free to express themselves in French if they so desire. Simultaneous interpretation is also available upon request (without notice ), a rare service in Canada available only in Ontario and New Brunswick. Moreover, since January 1, 1991, all Ontario laws have been translated from English into French. Previously, the French language version was only a translation and not a legal document, but now both English and French versions are equally authoritative in the Ontario Legislature . With the advent of the 1986 French Language Services Act, French is no longer considered a privilege but a right granted under the Rules of Parliament.

link

At the provincial level, New Brunswick is the only officially bilingual province and only Quebec has declared itself officially unilingual (French only). In practice, all provinces, including Quebec, offer some bilingual services and some education in both official languages up to the high school level. English and French are official languages in all three territories. In addition, Inuktitut is also an official language in Nunavut, and nine aboriginal languages have official status in the Northwest Territories.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

What other provinces are "have not"?

The have not provinces are almost all but Alberta. In truth the western provinces have been improving and the eastern provinces are getting worse.

[mentalfloss]

Not sure if this has been posted yet, but it is promising..

Canadian fatwa condemns 'honour killings'

[LonJowett]

Hate speech? No, if you're really Jewish, you're self-hating.

Jews who don't hate muslims must be self-hating? You must not think much of the jewish people yourself.

[CANADIEN]

Actually i was responding to your comment below,

And in most cases you are right,english is the prime language, but it does not take away from the fact that the province is following the official language act. Signifcant Demand as laid out in the offical Language act lays out the guide lines for each province to follow.

For example, Section 20 of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms guarantees the right of the Canadian public to communicate in English and French with any central government office or with regional offices where there is "a significant demand for communication with and services from that office." Significant demand is not defined in the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. One of the purposes of the Official Languages Act of 1988 was to remedy this omission.

One of the first areas addressed by the Ontario government was lawmaking . In 1970, the House Rules were amended to allow the use of French in the provincial parliament. Under section 13 of the House Rules, francophone members are free to express themselves in French if they so desire. Simultaneous interpretation is also available upon request (without notice ), a rare service in Canada available only in Ontario and New Brunswick. Moreover, since January 1, 1991, all Ontario laws have been translated from English into French. Previously, the French language version was only a translation and not a legal document, but now both English and French versions are equally authoritative in the Ontario Legislature . With the advent of the 1986 French Language Services Act, French is no longer considered a privilege but a right granted under the Rules of Parliament.

link

Neither the Charter nor the Official Languages Act addresses the issue of services to provincial government services. Provincial governments are not bound by either. The text of Section 20 of the Charter, which you referred to, mentions specifically the Parliament and the Government of Canada, not the provincial legislatures or provincial governments link

As for your comments about Ontario language issues, while they point out to a model other provincial governments would do well to emulate, the fact remains that French does not have the same status as English at the provincial government level. To give two examples, the Provincial Government can enact regulations in English only (federal regulations have to be in English in French), the same with orders-in-Council.

My point here, is that the statement, often uttered and repeated by you a few days ago, that "All of Canada is official bilingual" is a simplification that is proven innacurate on two counts. First, at the federal level, Canada has two official lnaguages a mari usque ad mare, including Quebec (Quebec's m*nure err I mean language laws) does not apply to the federal government and its institutions in Quebec. Second, no province exceptNew brunswick, is either officially or not officially bilngual.

Edited February 8, 2012 by CANADIEN

[cybercoma]

While the term "hate speech" is shall we say a bit over the top here, I find it interesting that Jews who fail to be bigoted and ignorant must be self-hating.

Section 13(1) of the Canadian Human Rights Act:

It is a discriminatory practice for a person or a group of persons acting in concert to communicate telephonically or to cause to be so communicated, repeatedly, [section 13(2) adds internet postings to this definition] in whole or in part by means of the facilities of a telecommunication undertaking within the legislative authority of Parliament, any matter that is likely to expose a person or persons to hatred or contempt by reason of the fact that person or those persons are identifiable on the basis of a prohibited ground of discrimination.

While you could argue that it's not hate speech, jbg is certainly skating on thin ice.

[CANADIEN]

Section 13(1) of the Canadian Human Rights Act:

While you could argue that it's not hate speech, jbg is certainly skating on thin ice.

I find the legal definition of hate speach to be too wide and too subject to interpretation. That being said, I still find certain speech to be reprehensive.

[jbg]

I find the legal definition of hate speach to be too wide and too subject to interpretation. That being said, I still find certain speech to be reprehensive.

Has this section survived a Charter of No Rights and Selective Freedom challenge yet?

[Peter F]

Canada (Human Rights Commission) v. Taylor, [1990] 3 S.C.R. 892

SCC judgement 1990

Canada (Human Rights Commission) v. Taylor, [1990] 3 S.C.R. 892

John Ross Taylor and the Western Guard Party Appellants

v.

Canadian Human Rights Commission

and the Attorney General of Canada Respondents

Held (La Forest, Sopinka and McLachlin JJ. dissenting in part): The appeal should be dismissed. Section 13(1) of the Canadian Human Rights Act is constitutional.

[jbg]

While the term "hate speech" is shall we say a bit over the top here, I find it interesting that Jews who fail to be bigoted and ignorant must be self-hating.

Jews who don't hate muslims must be self-hating? You must not think much of the jewish people yourself.

Both posts are a bit misleading. What I mean by "self-hating" is a refusal to be realistic about threats that the Jews face. The Jews are 1.9% of the populations of the U.S. and Canada. that is a very small number. Of world population it is around 0.2%. The Jews' social, economic and political success have made them targets of populists and less generously named kleptocrats. In other words the situation that exists for the Jews, quite often, is 200 wolves and one sheep voting on dinner.

[dre]

Both posts are a bit misleading. What I mean by "self-hating" is a refusal to be realistic about threats that the Jews face. The Jews are 1.9% of the populations of the U.S. and Canada. that is a very small number. Of world population it is around 0.2%. The Jews' social, economic and political success have made them targets of populists and less generously named kleptocrats. In other words the situation that exists for the Jews, quite often, is 200 wolves and one sheep voting on dinner.

What you REALLY mean by self hating is Jews that see things different than you do. And the real question is, who is doing the "hating"? You? Or them?

[CANADIEN]

Both posts are a bit misleading. What I mean by "self-hating" is a refusal to be realistic about threats that the Jews face. The Jews are 1.9% of the populations of the U.S. and Canada. that is a very small number. Of world population it is around 0.2%. The Jews' social, economic and political success have made them targets of populists and less generously named kleptocrats. In other words the situation that exists for the Jews, quite often, is 200 wolves and one sheep voting on dinner.

The misleading is - no surprise here - yours. There is a difference unrealistic about a threat and hating oneself. And there is a difference between being realistic and engaging in bigotry and hate- mongering.

[jbg]

The misleading is - no surprise here - yours. There is a difference unrealistic about a threat and hating oneself. And there is a difference between being realistic and engaging in bigotry and hate- mongering.

I think the Jews learned a bit about bigotry and hate-mongering during the 1000 years that ended in the bloody crescendo of the Holocaust.

[CANADIEN]

I think the Jews learned a bit about bigotry and hate-mongering during the 1000 years that ended in the bloody crescendo of the Holocaust.

And that is an excellent reason to be weary of and realistic about bigotry and fair mongering. It works poorly though as an excuse for engaging in them.

Edited February 9, 2012 by CANADIEN

[Tilter]

I find the legal definition of hate speach to be too wide and too subject to interpretation. That being said, I still find certain speech to be reprehensive.

Yeah--- I hate that.

[westguy]

Again, you blame these killings on your notion of them coming from a defective culture. Meanwhile, there are thousands of people that come from the same geographical regions and have the same religion, in other words they ostensibly come from the same culture, yet these honour killings don't seem to be a rampant issue. You seem to move your goalposts from individuals to groups then back to individuals. For instance, a particularly sick family commits a horrifying set of murders (individuals), you blame their entire culture (groups), thus we need to deny immigrants access to Canada or the US or Western Europe (individuals). Do you know what they call it when you attribute particular inferior characteristics to a group, then claim that individuals from that group have those characteristics without actually knowing anything about those individuals? I'll let you figure it out. In the meantime, allow me to leave you with a quote from senior bureaucrat that was close to Frederick Charles Blair, Canada's man responsible for immigration during WWII. When asked how many Jewish refugees Canada should allow in after the war, he replied, "None is too many."

Have you ever noticed that most terrorists are not Swedes, but Muslims???

[jbg]

Have you ever noticed that most terrorists are not Swedes, but Muslims???

I thought they were Jews, particularly when enraged by the death of a 99 year old Toronto rabbi (link).

[Jerry J. Fortin]

I thought they were Jews, particularly when enraged by the death of a 99 year old Toronto rabbi (link).

As I recall, it was the Jews declared as terrorists from 1945 to 1947 in what is now Israel.....

[jbg]

As I recall, it was the Jews declared as terrorists from 1945 to 1947 in what is now Israel.....

The Haganah did not deliberately target civilians. That is a huge difference. Even the Irgun, which was a bit more willing to inflict collateral damage, tried to find military targets. They were not pizza parlor bombers.