bud Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 in 48 hours, the UN Security Council will meet again to discuss whether Palestine should become a new state. if you support this movement, here is your chance to show it by spreading the word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socialist in Oil Country Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 In theory I would recognize Palestine, but there is no way we will do it in the near future. It would ruin diplomatic relations with most of our allies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rue Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 (edited) in 48 hours, the UN Security Council will meet again to discuss whether Palestine should become a new state. if you support this movement, here is your chance to show it by spreading the word. Oopsy Bud but forgot the last part of his call to arms. He will also be spreading the word on how we need to rally behind Hamas an Jihad and the Popular Resistance Committees as they continue to commit acts of violence against Israeli civilians until Israel is liberated from the evil Zionist Jews. Onwords people! Slew the Zionist imperialist colonialist swine! Tsk. Bud sometimes gets selective on what he screams out to the masses and forgets t insert the last part so I am only too glad to help. Say Bud when was the last time you took some of your activist concern, got out of Mama's basement and went and volunteered in your own community? Here let me spell it out. You are a pimple faced world activist as long as you can sit in Mama's basement using Mama's internet and computer and you don't have to do anything other then pound on the keyboard. You never met a Palestinian. You have never been to the West Bank, Israel or Gaza and your expertise comes from sound bites on the internet. You think Palestinians are little mascots. You patronize them as little objects you claim to defend. In fact you know nothing of them, how they live but you think you do. You think Hamas and Jihad are their heroes. You are a spoiled, sheltered, privileged, little pimple face who has no clue Hamas detests Palestinians as much as you think Israelis do. You have no idea how they terrorize and rule Palestinians with fear and violence. Not a clue. Oh you have it all figured out. Its black, its white. Israel black. Hamas white. There's no in between for Bud. No. Bud is the champion of the underdog. He couldn't possibily be a putz cheering on a facist organization that ridicules people like him and would rape him then chop him to little bits and leave him on the street for the dogs. Tell me Bud you ever met a Palestinian? You ever met a terrorist. You know where they shit, eat, sleep, what they think. Ever come face to face with them and look them in the eye? Lol. Better watch out Buddy boy. I hear they are moving next door to you. Your call to arms won't last the moment they block Mama's driveway and ridicule you when you come out of Mamas' basement and try imitate how they walk. Give up with that attempt at a beard Bud. No matter what you do, you still look like the guy from Scooby Doo not some Hamas terrorist. Edited August 24, 2011 by Rue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 Rue seems a little defensive today. Yeah, screw them getting their state, let the occupation continue. It's the only way to keep those evil people at bay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 Rue seems a little defensive today. Yeah, screw them getting their state, let the occupation continue. It's the only way to keep those evil people at bay. Rue's argument is pretty much an attack on Bud through and through. Too bad - it makes him look bad, makes his argument look bad and gets him reported. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorn Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 The Palestinian issue is not going to be helped by recognizing the area as a state. Nor, to be honest, do I feel it deserves such recognition given the nature of its screwed up government and institutions, and its lack of historical precedent. It hasn't the industrial or resource base to sustain itself as a state, unaided. It doesn't have the water. It doesn't have the organizational structure. And the space involved is too damned small. I understand the emotions involved. I've seen enough to know that if I was an Israeli I would _hate_ Palestinians, and Arabs in general. I would loath them. And if I was raised in the occupied territories I would _hate_ Israelis, and Jews in general. My hate would not be unreasoning. There have been plenty of outrages between these two groups to justify them hating each other. Unfortunately, the hate causes the outrages and the outrages cause the hate, and it's a never ending cycle. I do not see any logical way out of this even if Palestine became a state. It would be a sort of Arabic version of Bangladesh, but with the religious violence and organizational problems Pakistan is having, and there would probably be civil war between the Hamas and PLO people. It would be a local cats-paw for other nations, because of its lack of coherent government, and because of the desperate need for foreign and military aid. The only sensible solution I see is for the existing territories to be split up between Jordan and Egypt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 (edited) in 48 hours, the UN Security Council will meet again to discuss whether Palestine should become a new state. This is what your link actually says: In 48 hours, the UN Security Council will meet again to discuss Palestine's bid to become the 194th country. Edited August 24, 2011 by American Woman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 The Palestinian issue is not going to be helped by recognizing the area as a state. Nor, to be honest, do I feel it deserves such recognition given the nature of its screwed up government and institutions, and its lack of historical precedent. It hasn't the industrial or resource base to sustain itself as a state, unaided. It doesn't have the water. It doesn't have the organizational structure. And the space involved is too damned small. lack of historic precedent???wtf so the USA shouldn't be a country because it had no historic precedent?...lack of industrial or resource base? you mean like Israel, that survived only because of massive US aid?It doesn't have water ya because the Israeli's have confiscated it for themselves, Israel steal/pump some 500million cubic meters from palestinian land each year... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 with the number of projected votes already lined up it appears likely Palestine will be recognized as a state and from what I understand any US veto can be over ruled by the general assembly...if this all comes about Israel would then be guilty of occupying an independent state just as Iraq occupied Kuwait... at last estimation Palestine has 125 votes of the 128 required to over rule the US veto... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 The Palestinian issue is not going to be helped by recognizing the area as a state. I disagree, it could actually help things quite a lot. Establishing a state would provide a hard set of boundaries and since the fledgling state would be heavily subsidized by the west we get some leverage over them. This kind of leverage is exactly how we got Egypt to be nice to Israel. More importantly though you establish/reaffirm exactly where the legal border is. The position of the international community has been too ambiguous about this, and this has actually made the situation worse. Its definately worth a try. Nor, to be honest, do I feel it deserves such recognition given the nature of its screwed up government and institutions, and its lack of historical precedent. The status quo is the PERFECT recipe to make sure that government stays weak and screwed up forever. Not to mention that a stateless enclave with no strong central government is the ultimate breeding ground for terrorists... which is exactly the reason we are trying to build western backed/influenced governments in places like Afghanistan. The Status quo is about the worst situation possible in terms of either side having any security. We need to give up on the idea that these two belligerents can negotiate with each other in good faith. Its utterly silly to believe that at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 I disagree, it could actually help things quite a lot. Establishing a state would provide a hard set of boundaries and since the fledgling state would be heavily subsidized by the west we get some leverage over them. This kind of leverage is exactly how we got Egypt to be nice to Israel. More importantly though you establish/reaffirm exactly where the legal border is. The position of the international community has been too ambiguous about this, and this has actually made the situation worse. Its definately worth a try. The status quo is the PERFECT recipe to make sure that government stays weak and screwed up forever. Not to mention that a stateless enclave with no strong central government is the ultimate breeding ground for terrorists... which is exactly the reason we are trying to build western backed/influenced governments in places like Afghanistan. The Status quo is about the worst situation possible in terms of either side having any security. We need to give up on the idea that these two belligerents can negotiate with each other in good faith. Its utterly silly to believe that at this point. israel doesn't want to negotiate it benefits from a permanent state of unrest, it has no intention of ever giving up any land and every intention of permanently keeping palestinians stateless in ever shrinking bantustans... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 This kind of leverage is exactly how we got Egypt to be nice to Israel. Oh sure..."we" gave Egypt, Jordan, and Palestine $100 billion. Isn't "we" great? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 Oh sure..."we" gave Egypt, Jordan, and Palestine $100 billion. Isn't "we" great? Yup everyone chipped in. You borrowed the money from the rest of the world to give to them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saipan Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 in 48 hours, the UN Security Council will meet again to discuss whether Palestine should become a new state. if you support this movement, here is your chance to show it by spreading the word. I recognize Tibet. A real country. How about UN? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonam Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 with the number of projected votes already lined up it appears likely Palestine will be recognized as a state and from what I understand any US veto can be over ruled by the general assembly...if this all comes about Israel would then be guilty of occupying an independent state just as Iraq occupied Kuwait... at last estimation Palestine has 125 votes of the 128 required to over rule the US veto... Sounds good, then any time Palestinians launch rockets into Israel, Israel can "legitimately" respond in kind against a sovereign state that has committed an act of war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scouterjim Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 The US will veto any attempt at recognizing, or seating the Palestinian state in the UN. Israel has ordedred this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 The US will veto any attempt at recognizing, or seating the Palestinian state in the UN. Israel has ordedred this. Hell with that...the US (and Canada) have "ordered this". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scouterjim Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 Hell with that...the US (and Canada) have "ordered this". Israel tells the US what to veto in the UN. They have done so in the past, and will continue to do so in the future. The US complies because AIPAC has a powerful lobby in The House and Senate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogOnPorch Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 I like how that video exploits children just like Hamas does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 Israel tells the US what to veto in the UN. They have done so in the past, and will continue to do so in the future. The US complies because AIPAC has a powerful lobby in The House and Senate. UN resolution 377- the General Assembly majority (128)with the support of one permenent security council member(China) can over-rule a veto from a security council member(USA)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 (edited) double post Edited August 26, 2011 by wyly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 Should Palestine be recognized as a state before it has a uniform/united government? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dre Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 (edited) Should Palestine be recognized as a state before it has a uniform/united government? I dont see any good reason why not. The law says to qualify for statehood you need a population, a territory, and a "stable and independant government" to which the "bulk of the population renders habitual obedience to". You could start with the west bank to dodge this question in any case. Edited August 25, 2011 by dre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 I dont see any good reason why not. The law says to qualify for statehood you need a population, a territory, and a "stable and independant government" to which the "bulk of the population renders habitual obedience to". You could start with the west bank to dodge this question in any case. from observation I'd say the palestinian government is as stable and more functional than the US government at the moment... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 Israel tells the US what to veto in the UN. They have done so in the past, and will continue to do so in the future. The US complies because AIPAC has a powerful lobby in The House and Senate. Clue for you: AIPAC is an American lobby. As in USA. As in US interests. So what's Canada's excuse for not wanting a Palestinian state at this time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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