xul Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 If we clamp down on those people who are repeat offenders, crime is virtually certain to fall That's the theory which Gahdafi used to "clamp down" Libyan rebels . I have to say sometimes it works, but sometimes it just backfires like this time . If the criminals knew that they would get a life sentence if they were caught by police twice, what would they do? Would they stop to commit crimes and become law-abiding citizens? I guess a few of them might be...but others may just buy a gun and shoot at the policemen who try to arrest them. Quote
cybercoma Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 People don't commit crimes thinking they will be caught. Quote
Saipan Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 If the criminals knew that they would get a life sentence if they were caught by police twice, what would they do? Far fewer would kill anyone if they knew they'll be hanging. I doubt anyne would shoplift if they knew they will get 10 lashes in front of the store they stole from. Drunk drivers would be driving bicycle or walking - like people did before cars came out. Canada would be known as the safest country. Quote
Scotty Posted April 11, 2011 Author Report Posted April 11, 2011 People don't commit crimes thinking they will be caught. Perhaps not. But those who fear what will happen if they get caught are the ones NOT committing crimes. Quote It is an inverted moral calculus that tries to persuade the world to demonize one state that tries its civilized best to abide in a difficult time and place, and rides merrily by the examples and practices of dozens of states and leaderships that drop into brutality every day without a twinge of regret or a whisper of condemnation. - Rex Murphy
guyser Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 Far fewer would kill anyone if they knew they'll be hanging. That Texas murder rate must be dropping through the floor. Quote
eyeball Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 Far fewer would kill anyone if they knew they'll be hanging. I doubt anyne would shoplift if they knew they will get 10 lashes in front of the store they stole from. Drunk drivers would be driving bicycle or walking - like people did before cars came out. Canada would be known as the safest country. Not safe from the rule-makers/keepers who would soon be lashing us for just about anything they could dream up like chewing bubblegum or speaking out about the right to do so. The trouble with right-wing authoritarians is that they don't know when to quit. They're just a Nanny of a slightly different kind, meaner to be sure, but still just as stifling and fatal as the left-wing kind. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
M.Dancer Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 That Texas murder rate must be dropping through the floor. It is.... Which is surprising given their proximity to Mexica http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/murder-rates-nationally-and-state#MRalpha Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
guyser Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 It is.... Which is surprising given their proximity to Mexica http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/murder-rates-nationally-and-state#MRalpha Fairly static, I looked at the numbers chart. Still around 1300+ murders a year but a drop is there,1378 to 1328 or so. Quote
cybercoma Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 It is.... Which is surprising given their proximity to Mexica http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/murder-rates-nationally-and-state#MRalpha I think the point is this: Average Murder rates 2009 Death penalty states: 4.9 States without: 2.8 Tough on crime. And if you look here: http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/deterrence-states-without-death-penalty-have-had-consistently-lower-murder-rates You'll see that the difference in murder rates between states with and without the death penalty has increased significantly over the last 20 years. Quote
Scotty Posted April 11, 2011 Author Report Posted April 11, 2011 I think the point is this: The point is none of that matters because we are not the United States and the socioeconomic factors at play there are not at play here. Quote It is an inverted moral calculus that tries to persuade the world to demonize one state that tries its civilized best to abide in a difficult time and place, and rides merrily by the examples and practices of dozens of states and leaderships that drop into brutality every day without a twinge of regret or a whisper of condemnation. - Rex Murphy
Saipan Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 That Texas murder rate must be dropping through the floor. It is. Florida too. Quote
Saipan Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 You'll see that the difference in murder rates between states with and without the death penalty has increased significantly over the last 20 years. Why not NAME the states with high homicide rate? Quote
guyser Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 It is. Florida too. It isnt , but you sleep well thinking whatever your head decides. Quote
cybercoma Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 Why not NAME the states with high homicide rate? Why not CLICK the links provided? Quote
xul Posted April 11, 2011 Report Posted April 11, 2011 (edited) Far fewer would kill anyone if they knew they'll be hanging. If anyone knew he would be hung once he was caught, fighting back would logically be the choice to increase his chance of survival. I doubt anyne would shoplift if they knew they will get 10 lashes in front of the store they stole from. I bet it wasn't the first time a thief was beaten, but I'm sure there still are theives in India. Furor engulfs Brampton MP in child beating Ruby Dhalla, in India on a two-week trip, was at an event on Monday in a northern village when the purse was snatched. Half an hour later, a boy, Sachin, 11, and his little sister Bindia, 9, were caught with the help of members of the public and Indian police travelling with Dhalla, police said.The bag was returned, the two children were taken into custody and at least one was beaten. Images of the children were flashed across India and around the world. Drunk drivers would be driving bicycle or walking - like people did before cars came out. I think drunk drivers have already been banned on road by laws and will be fined or jailed in every country if they are caught, let alone they have more odds to die or to be injured in car crashes. But there still are drunk drivers just becasue they are not always caught or they don't always crash their cars. Canada would be known as the safest country. I think Canada is already safer than those countries which lash thieves. Edited April 11, 2011 by xul Quote
Saipan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 Why not CLICK the links provided? Good idea. Falling crime in USA http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1963761,00.html Most states have now Concealed Carry Law. http://southdakotapolitics.blogs.com/.a/6a00d8341c046f53ef0115722d8c0e970b-800wi And the firearms laws. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_(by_state) Quote
Saipan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 If anyone knew he would be hung once he was caught, fighting back would logically be the choice to increase his chance of survival. How many survived? I think drunk drivers have already been banned on road by laws So why so many get their licence back? And not just once. I think Canada is already safer than those countries which lash thieves. You think that? How many cars get vandalized in Singapore? Quote
Battletoads Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 We already addressed the drugs issue on this thread. This seems to be a myth. With the Cons new mandatory minimums for drug offences the myth will become reality. Quote "You can lead a Conservative to knowledge, but you can't make him think."
Battletoads Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 I thought the whole argument from the opposition was that this change in law would REQUIRE more prisons because of all the prisoners. Now you're saying that these prisoners are imaginary? Then what's the problem with the policy? I guess it won't cost that much after all! I don't recall ever saying that. Either lay off the hallucinogens or check yourself in, or both. Seriously, mental delusions are no laughing matter. Quote "You can lead a Conservative to knowledge, but you can't make him think."
Battletoads Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 How many cars get vandalized in Singapore? How many people get tried without a jury in Canada? Quote "You can lead a Conservative to knowledge, but you can't make him think."
Saipan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 With the Cons new mandatory minimums for drug offences the myth will become reality. Too vague. Quote
Saipan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 How many people get tried without a jury in Canada? All those tried by judge only. Quote
Bryan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 Far fewer would kill anyone if they knew they'll be hanging. Dead people seldom reoffend too. I doubt anyne would shoplift if they knew they will get 10 lashes in front of the store they stole from. I'd love to see us incorporate caning into our penal code. That would be a day to truly be proud. Quote
Saipan Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 Prisons would be half empty and we would $ave billion$. Quote
cybercoma Posted April 12, 2011 Report Posted April 12, 2011 Why have prisons at all, Saipan? We could just allow everyone to be armed and if they feel slighted in any way, they could carry out the death penalty themselves. Quote
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