Michael Hardner Posted February 23, 2011 Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 CBC Respondents on both sides of the border were asked their opinion on a range of issues on climate change, starting with whether they believed it was real.In Canada, 80 per cent believe in the science behind climate change, compared with 58 per cent in the United States. I found it encouraging that 58% of Americans believe the science. The political will to do something is now there, so what will happen ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 23, 2011 Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 ...I found it encouraging that 58% of Americans believe the science. The political will to do something is now there, so what will happen ? Nothing...yet....why do you think an opinion poll translates into political and economic change so readily? Believing in the "science" but still doing nothing because of competing interests is also an expected outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWiz Posted February 23, 2011 Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 (edited) CBC I found it encouraging that 58% of Americans believe the science. The political will to do something is now there, so what will happen ? But is the MONEY? <by edit> BTW - There's MORE Government will in the US than there is in Canada under Harper... Edited February 23, 2011 by GWiz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 23, 2011 Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 BTW - There's MORE Government will in the US than there is in Canada under Harper... ...or Martin or Chretien...they completely blew off Kyoto, while the Americans, who never even ratified the treaty, slowed the growth in emissions far better than in Canada. Go figure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted February 23, 2011 Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 CBC I found it encouraging that 58% of Americans believe the science. The political will to do something is now there, so what will happen ? Don't start chest-thumping about those poll numbers! We are already well in to a brainwashing onslaught by big oil and their puppets in the Conservative Party and P.C. parties locally. Harper has, as quietly as possible, shifted his Government's policy on climate change from an advocacy of Cap and Trade to outright denial of the issue. He's got his Government stocked with a bunch of deniers now, and according to a recent report by the European Commission, they are preparing for a legal fight with the Canadian Government because the E.U. wants to continue a ban on dirty tar sands oil from being imported by Europe. Now, add this to the steady stream of oil-funded propaganda by fake climate science groups like "Friends of Science", and their media like...well, pretty much everything that's run by Izzy Asper, Shaw's Corus Radio Network and Quebecor. The only thing standing in the way of the Conservative propaganda machine is that they don't have editorial control over the CBC yet, like the corporate world in the states got by the continual defunding of public broadcasting. A CBC that is totally dependent on advertising dollars and corporate endowments will have a drawer full of Kevin O'Leary clones all trying to out-rightwing each other...just like they do on Foxnews.....anyway, expect those high numbers supporting the scientific consensus on global warming to drop steadily as more and more people read more and more stupid bogus headlines like "31000 scientists don't believe in global warming" on the front page of their daily newspaper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 Nothing...yet....why do you think an opinion poll translates into political and economic change so readily? Believing in the "science" but still doing nothing because of competing interests is also an expected outcome. I didn't say 'readily'. But the will is there. Now the slow train can start leaving the station. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 23, 2011 Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 I didn't say 'readily'. But the will is there. Now the slow train can start leaving the station. Not so fast...I think you are jumping to an unsupported conclusion. Believing in the "science" does not immediately follow with anywhere near as many people jumping on that train, especially when they get wind of the economic downside. The higher Canadian poll numbers and absolute zero action to date is evidence of that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 Not so fast...I think you are jumping to an unsupported conclusion. Believing in the "science" does not immediately follow with anywhere near as many people jumping on that train, especially when they get wind of the economic downside. The higher Canadian poll numbers and absolute zero action to date is evidence of that. It always takes time to get the politics going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 23, 2011 Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 It always takes time to get the politics going. Sure, but you are discounting another real possibility previously discussed. There may be a conscious political decision to do next to nothing anyway, even in the face of credible "science". More emphasis will be placed on adaptation than climate change mitigation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlight Graham Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 CBC I found it encouraging that 58% of Americans believe the science. The political will to do something is now there, so what will happen ? Here's the problem. A large portion of the strongest supporters for action on climate change are young people (18 to 30-somethings). But young people don't vote. Not voting means politicians are less likely to implement said CC policies. Young people do recycle though, so at least there's some hope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Sure, but you are discounting another real possibility previously discussed. There may be a conscious political decision to do next to nothing anyway, even in the face of credible "science". More emphasis will be placed on adaptation than climate change mitigation. Will be... when ? I haven't heard adaptation mentioned in the mainstream media yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Will be... when ? I haven't heard adaptation mentioned in the mainstream media yet. You don't have to...it is happening all around you. Umbrella sales are up. http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/Everyone%20Else/pages-7/Umbrella-sales-spike-in-flooded-Northwest-Pakistan-Scrape-TV-The-World-on-your-side.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 You don't have to...it is happening all around you. Umbrella sales are up. http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/Everyone%20Else/pages-7/Umbrella-sales-spike-in-flooded-Northwest-Pakistan-Scrape-TV-The-World-on-your-side.html Of course that will happen on an individual basis, but people look to government to solve problems. The US passed the Patriot Act to deal with a problem, they didn't rely on individuals to take care of it, right ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Of course that will happen on an individual basis, but people look to government to solve problems. The US passed the Patriot Act to deal with a problem, they didn't rely on individuals to take care of it, right ? The PATRIOT Act has built in sunset clauses....and has to be renewed. Other measures do indeed rely on individuals. There is nothing equivalent on the horizon for so called climate change, and in fact the cap and trade effort died a quick death. You will only see movement when the negative cost of doing less/nothing approaches the cost of doing more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 The PATRIOT Act has built in sunset clauses....and has to be renewed. Other measures do indeed rely on individuals. There is nothing equivalent on the horizon for so called climate change, and in fact the cap and trade effort died a quick death. That's all interesting. But my point stands: governments will move to action - even in the US - if the people see a need for it. You will only see movement when the negative cost of doing less/nothing approaches the cost of doing more. Maybe so, but the first step has been taken. Maybe we'll see adaptation mentioned more now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Of course that will happen on an individual basis, but people look to government to solve problems. The US passed the Patriot Act to deal with a problem, they didn't rely on individuals to take care of it, right ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_PATRIOT_Act The Patriot Act (Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism Act of 2001)was written/developed and rammed through in under 50 days without many actually reading the bill and with little chance of review. You think something of that magnitude would be scrutinized, but apparently it was not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USA_PATRIOT_Act The Patriot Act (Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism Act of 2001)was written/developed and rammed through in under 50 days without many actually reading the bill and with little chance of review. You think something of that magnitude would be scrutinized, but apparently it was not. My intention was to use that act as an example of the government acting on the people's will. I don't want to drift the thread on it, though. A search of Google News for "climate adapt" provides 735 hits to 1,944 for "climate prevent". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 My intention was to use that act as an example of the government acting on the people's will. I don't want to drift the thread on it, though. There is no such "people's will" for climate change. You have made a logical jump that is not supported by the facts. Similarly, are millions of Canadians marching in the streets demanding that the oil patch be shut down? Nope. A search of Google News for "climate adapt" provides 735 hits to 1,944 for "climate prevent". Do you think this is how policy and action is determined? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Do you think this is how policy and action is determined? Not at all - I'm taking the temperature, in a crude way, as I wasn't sure of how much 'adaptation' is being discussed today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Not at all - I'm taking the temperature, in a crude way, as I wasn't sure of how much 'adaptation' is being discussed today. Doesn't have to be discussed at all...people and markets are adapting in real time. Humans have always been very adaptable that way. There are opportunities and risks, just as before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfezziwig Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Does anyone really think a politican in Canada or the USA will suggest more taxes and regulations to combat green house gases? Even the biggest tree hugger isn't ready for that today, everyone knows our debt and potential future econmic collapse are the the most important issues and will be for years to come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted February 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 everyone knows our debt and potential future econmic collapse are the the most important issues and will be for years to come. However, fewer people realize that you can constantly use the economy when fear mongering, no matter how rich we get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GostHacked Posted February 25, 2011 Report Share Posted February 25, 2011 Does anyone really think a politican in Canada or the USA will suggest more taxes and regulations to combat green house gases? Even the biggest tree hugger isn't ready for that today, everyone knows our debt and potential future econmic collapse are the the most important issues and will be for years to come. It's not a question of IF .. it's a question of when. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Canadian vs. US... versus UK attitudes on climate change: re: recent ICM poll... the UK public's belief in global warming as a man-made danger has not significantly changed since the bogus hackergate denierfest and cold weather of the past two winters. 83% of Britons agreed that climate change is a current or imminent threat, with just 14% saying global warming poses no threat. A large majority of people think that humanity is causing climate change, with 68% agreeing and 24% choosing to blame non-man-made factors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukin Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Canadian vs. US... versus UK attitudes on climate change: re: recent ICM poll... the UK public's belief in global warming as a man-made danger has not significantly changed since the bogus hackergate denierfest and cold weather of the past two winters. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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