True or False?

[Topaz]

John Baird, stood up in the Commons and said that because of the Tories Canadians have an extra $3000.00 in their pockets. Is this true or false? Is he talking about the reduction in GST? If so, I like to know were the $3000.00 in savings is because in my case....no way.

[M.Dancer]

John Baird, stood up in the Commons and said that because of the Tories Canadians have an extra $3000.00 in their pockets. Is this true or false? Is he talking about the reduction in GST? If so, I like to know were the $3000.00 in savings is because in my case....no way.

Probably true...not all at once however, but over the last 4 years. The $100 child care dohicky alone was worth $3600 to our family.

[Smallc]

I believe that the average family now pays about $2000 less per year in taxes than in 2005 (when all tax cuts and changes are calculated), so I can see it.

[scribblet]

It could be for many seniors because of the pension splitting, we saved over $2,500,it would be nice if all families could income split.

There was also a new $1,000. employment tax credit and a drop in the tax rate...

[fellowtraveller]

So it was more than $3000 per?

I guess that makes it false and John Baird is a liar.

[Smallc]

So it was more than $3000 per?

I guess that makes it false and John Baird is a liar.

The average is now $3000 per year, per family. That is up from the numbers that I had heard in 2008.

[Topaz]

I look at it this way. The saying "If its too good to be true it probably isn't" Why? Because anytime a government cuts and doesn't really watch the tax $$, taxpayers will pay for it later. So any money the Tories say they have saved us, it really isn't true because the deficit is up, we are paying interest on that debt. The only way a taxpayer can really enjoy a cut, is to have the government NOT in the RED and quit spending our money. Am I wrong?

[The_Squid]

I look at it this way. The saying "If its too good to be true it probably isn't" Why? Because anytime a government cuts and doesn't really watch the tax $$, taxpayers will pay for it later. So any money the Tories say they have saved us, it really isn't true because the deficit is up, we are paying interest on that debt. The only way a taxpayer can really enjoy a cut, is to have the government NOT in the RED and quit spending our money. Am I wrong?

You're exactly right.... we may be saving some in taxes now, but that will have to be compensated for with interest later.

And you only save if you don't pay all the other things that went up. My property taxes have increased sharply. The Province has increased all sorts of fees on a myriad of services... Just because the feds take a little less, doesn't mean that other governments aren't scooping up those savings and then some....

[msj]

I believe it.

It's an average and is accumulated over the past 3 or 4 years.

Let's take a senior who has OAS, CPP, and a pension from, say, Air Canada for $100,000 (numbers are approximate). Let's say his wife only has CPP as income.

The pension splitting alone lets this couple save over $9,000 per year in income taxes.

I should know: I do their tax returns.

The best I have ever seen was over $13,000 in savings.

Now you know why curmudgeonly old people love the CPC so much.

[Keepitsimple]

I look at it this way. The saying "If its too good to be true it probably isn't" Why? Because anytime a government cuts and doesn't really watch the tax $$, taxpayers will pay for it later. So any money the Tories say they have saved us, it really isn't true because the deficit is up, we are paying interest on that debt. The only way a taxpayer can really enjoy a cut, is to have the government NOT in the RED and quit spending our money. Am I wrong?

So....why ask the true or false question? It appears you're not satisfied with either answer.

[BubberMiley]

it would be nice if all families could income split.

Even gay families, or do you draw the line there?

Amazing how you can raise the tax rate and true-believer CPCers will see it as a drop.

[Bryan]

There is no question that my tax bill is noticeably lighter since the Conservatives have been in office.

$3000/yr is about right. It was actually more than that up until this year, but my daughter is in school full-time now, so we don't get the UCCB anymore.

That's not even including the GST reduction actually. On that front, I've saved another couple thousand at least this year alone. I also took advantage of some of the new tax credits (and the economy) to make some big ticket expenditures that I would not have been able to afford a few years ago, and paid several thousand less than I would have otherwise.

[msj]

That's not even including the GST reduction actually. On that front, I've saved another couple thousand at least this year alone.

With the reduction in GST of 2% I'm guessing you bought an Audi A8.

Am I close?

Edited October 26, 2010 by msj

[August1991]

John Baird, stood up in the Commons and said that because of the Tories Canadians have an extra $3000.00 in their pockets. Is this true or false? Is he talking about the reduction in GST? If so, I like to know were the $3000.00 in savings is because in my case....no way.

The average Canadian has a disposable income (after income tax, property tax, etc) of about $30,000 per year. Shelter/food (both exempt from GST) account for about 45% of this disposable income so 55%, or about $16,500 is subject to GST. The Tories cut the GST from 7% to 5% so 2% of $16,500 is about $330/year - on average. For four years, that would be about $1300.

My calculation is a (very) low ball because some food and some shelter is GST taxable, and I think I underestimated disposable income.

----

Gawd, I hate Statistics Canada. Their web site is crappy and unlike other countries, it's impossible to find stats, or you have to pay. Their searches always give reports with an obvious political agenda.

I used non-Statcan sites for these rough numbers. (No doubt that the original numbers come from Statcan.)

Edited October 26, 2010 by August1991

[msj]

I think people are forgetting the various measures they have brought in:

Child Fitness tax credit - worth up to $75 per year

Home renovation tax credit - worth up to $1,350 for 2009

Employment income tax credit - worth about $150

Pension splitting for seniors - varies but can be worth tens of thousands of dollars per my post above

Universal Child Benefit - $1,200 per year per kid under 6. Is taxable though so for may people it's worth less than $900 (even when the spouse earns $0 it still reduces a tax credit that transfers to the spouse who does have earnings)

GST cut of 2% points.

Those are just off the top of my head.

For people like my wife and me (under 40, professional, childless couple) you can clearly see why we prefer the Liberals: they cut my marginal tax rate at various times (from 17% to 15%, from 26% to 22%, from 29% to 26% by shifting the brackets around to have less income taxed at the 29% level - hell, to have less income taxed at the 15%, 22% and 26% levels).

But for most other people - if you have kids or are a senior, yeah, the CPC have been pretty good to you.

[Bryan]

With the reduction in GST of 2% I'm guessing you bought an Audi A8.

Am I close?

Close-ish.

Not an Audi, but a new vehicle was part of it. There were a bunch of other things too. The new kitchen was the really big ticket item.

[Molly]

Our tax bill is down quite a lot, but that's largely because our income has been cut in half.

(And, of course, we didn't/don't qualify for any of the safety-net programs either, not even EI.)

[William Ashley]

John Baird, stood up in the Commons and said that because of the Tories Canadians have an extra $3000.00 in their pockets. Is this true or false? Is he talking about the reduction in GST? If so, I like to know were the $3000.00 in savings is because in my case....no way.

According to my numbers with the 50 billion deficit the Tories ran - apparently Canadians owe an extra $2000+ Tack that on to the $10000+ that canadians lost last year is $12000 (each) he has taken from Canadians pockets + interest, in the last two years.

How much do Canadians save when it is borrowed money that needs to be paid back with interest? Huh? Its not 3000$ in my pocket its $12000 out of everyone I knows pocket.

The money ain't free wake the heck up - Canadians won't even be able to pay for standard health care and Old age security in 10 years. There is no room to raise taxes with cost of living going up- food prices and everything else is going to be higher - the situation will be less room meaning higher rents - GET A CLUE. It ain't money in your pocket - they are running a HUGE DEBT! WAKE UP!

30% of taxes are just paying the current debt interest... that isn't paying down the debt that is paying so that it doesn't increase hugely. Canada's GDP is over a trillion dollars - 1% of GDP is 10 billion dollars - 20 Billion is the annual "challenge" of debt for the next 10 years or bring the debt up to 1 trillion dollars is what they are trying to do... that is the challenge putting canadians in debt a trillion dollars.... .... WAKE THE HECK UP!

Canda will be over 1 trillion dollars in debt before the end of the next decade if these bufoons continue to run the books.

1 in 4 Canadians will be retired, 1 in 10 disabled 1 in 10 unemployed 1/4 underage for employment and the other 25% ---- will be stuck with everything - it ain't tenable. (the other 5% is criminals and people who are elitisits and expats)

Technology ain't cheap.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/oct/25/impending-global-food-crisis

Edited October 26, 2010 by William Ashley

[segnosaur]

John Baird, stood up in the Commons and said that because of the Tories Canadians have an extra $3000.00 in their pockets. Is this true or false? Is he talking about the reduction in GST? If so, I like to know were the $3000.00 in savings is because in my case....no way.

Keep in mind that that $3000 would have been an average. As others have pointed out, some might have seen a very substantial reduction (e.g. seniors, those with families, people doing renovations.) I myself (as a single person with no dependents) saw very little reduction in my taxes. (While I am a bit annoyed about that, before I condemn the conservatives I have to consider the alternatives. Some of the policies proposed by the Liberals in previous elections might have actually cost me money.)