Canada Revenue Agency

[Topaz]

Now it seems Canadians can't trust the people work for the CRA, Canada Revenue Agency. Some of the workers have been looking at some Canadians private tax data. Some person accessed 37,000 emails and 776 documents containing private financial info. on Canadians. The list goes on and on. These people should be punished and names printed in the paper and then fired. http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100620/jmoney/nosy_tax_collectors

[Borg]

I have said it many times:

I would rather have a sister working in a whore house than a brother working for Canada tax collectors.

Borg

[Jerry J. Fortin]

I have said it many times:

I would rather have a sister working in a whore house than a brother working for Canada tax collectors.

Borg

Dude, you are messed up!

[Shwa]

Now it seems Canadians can't trust the people work for the CRA, Canada Revenue Agency. Some of the workers have been looking at some Canadians private tax data. Some person accessed 37,000 emails and 776 documents containing private financial info. on Canadians. The list goes on and on. These people should be punished and names printed in the paper and then fired. http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100620/jmoney/nosy_tax_collectors

29 of 40k employees is about .0725%, so it is a very small group. Most of the the access was limited and any damage contained. However the potential for damage could be much larger AND those 29 are only the ones that got caught. I suspect the actual percentage of unauthorized access is much higher. There is also much unauthorized access to accounts and personal information in other large data holding departments such as Border Services, Employment Insurance and Pensions, etc. The problem here is that CRA staff could access those records since it is difficult to lock individal records in a database. If it is a system you have access to already, to do your job, all you need is a SIN to do anyone elses.

Sometimes if you read the Ottawa newspapers, they will have the names of employees that were actually charged with a crime. Otherwise, if there is internal discipline you will likely never hear any names or much detail other than an audit report.

[Moonbox]

It's a matter of trust. There is a code of conduct I'm sure CRA employees must follow, much like at a bank, where you don't act like an ass and access people's info without reason or authorization.

When people break that trust, they should be summarily dismissed and criminally charged if the breach warrants it.

[Jerry J. Fortin]

It's a matter of trust. There is a code of conduct I'm sure CRA employees must follow, much like at a bank, where you don't act like an ass and access people's info without reason or authorization.

When people break that trust, they should be summarily dismissed and criminally charged if the breach warrants it.

Lets apply that to the big cheese plate first shall we. Lets look at our elected representatives before we look at the low-life pond scum citizens who are just working for a living. Sure there is likely to be a few bad apples, expensive rotten bastards at that for sure but still......

I do agree it is time to fight corruption, but lets set our sights on the right target to start with for a change.

[Michael Hardner]

29 of 40k employees is about .0725%, so it is a very small group. Most of the the access was limited and any damage contained. However the potential for damage could be much larger AND those 29 are only the ones that got caught. I suspect the actual percentage of unauthorized access is much higher.

That's odd - didn't you criticize my myopia on another thread for basic my conclusions on published reports, with regards to timelines for government hiring levels.

Yet here you are here suspecting malfeasance - based on ... what exactly ?

[Jerry J. Fortin]

That's odd - didn't you criticize my myopia on another thread for basic my conclusions on published reports, with regards to timelines for government hiring levels.

Yet here you are here suspecting malfeasance - based on ... what exactly ?

Same pooh, different location.

[Argus]

It's a matter of trust. There is a code of conduct I'm sure CRA employees must follow, much like at a bank, where you don't act like an ass and access people's info without reason or authorization.

CRA has a code of ethics which is so broad based, written in legalese, that it basically justifies disciplining an employee for breathing if the employer so interprets it.

As to the story above, I would assume the majority of the employees involved were dismissed. I had a discussion with a highly placed union (UTE) rep a couple of years back, and she flat out told me that if someone is caught snooping in private tax records there is nothing the union can do to help them. They can be fired on the spot and usually are. However, discipline normally offers a range of punishment options to the director or director general involved, and so your punishment might be lowered depending on how that individual reacts to the circumstances.

[Argus]

I have said it many times:

I would rather have a sister working in a whore house than a brother working for Canada tax collectors.

Borg

Dumb statement. It's true CRA is a hopeless den of red tape and idiotic bureaucratic management but so is much of the rest of the government. And most of the jobs actually don't involve direct contact with taxpayers or impact the taxes they pay. Like every other organization, it is filled with messengers, tech support types, internal services clerks, web site designers, marketing developers, communications specialists, translators, trainers, legal experts, and of course, those horrifying HR people.

[ToadBrother]

Now it seems Canadians can't trust the people work for the CRA, Canada Revenue Agency. Some of the workers have been looking at some Canadians private tax data. Some person accessed 37,000 emails and 776 documents containing private financial info. on Canadians. The list goes on and on. These people should be punished and names printed in the paper and then fired. http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/100620/jmoney/nosy_tax_collectors

Bad people do bad things... News at 11.

[Shwa]

That's odd - didn't you criticize my myopia on another thread for basic my conclusions on published reports, with regards to timelines for government hiring levels.

Yet here you are here suspecting malfeasance - based on ... what exactly ?

Apples and oranges. I am not advocating scrapping CRA because .0725% of employees are caught snooping the taxation databases.

And I wasn't criticizing your myopia, I was merely pointing out that you shouldn't blame it on the object of your gaze. But at least you admit to it and that's a good start.

[Shwa]

Dumb statement. It's true CRA is a hopeless den of red tape and idiotic bureaucratic management but so is much of the rest of the government. And most of the jobs actually don't involve direct contact with taxpayers or impact the taxes they pay. Like every other organization, it is filled with messengers, tech support types, internal services clerks, web site designers, marketing developers, communications specialists, translators, trainers, legal experts, and of course, those horrifying HR people.

In modern parlance, "information workers."

http://www.tbs-sct.gc.ca/rpp/2010-2011/inst/nar/nar01-eng.asp

[Michael Hardner]

Apples and oranges. I am not advocating scrapping CRA because .0725% of employees are caught snooping the taxation databases.

And I wasn't criticizing your myopia, I was merely pointing out that you shouldn't blame it on the object of your gaze. But at least you admit to it and that's a good start.

But what of 'your suspicions' ? Where do they come from, if not from this report ? Do you have inside info on this or are you psychic - how do you know ?

[Shwa]

But what of 'your suspicions' ? Where do they come from, if not from this report ? Do you have inside info on this or are you psychic - how do you know ?

So you missed the part in my previous post where I said, "If you read Ottawa newspapers..."

Then there is the typical underreporting of crime.

Then there is the notion that reported crimes are only those that are caught and could likely be more. (unless you are of the belief that all criminal acts are reported)

Extrapolate those sorts of concepts to the idea of fraud, theft, unauthorized access, etc., into the notion that this might play into reporting in the governments and I get suspicion. What do you get?

Have a look at the Receiver General Public Accounts for 2009

Here is the PDF for Volume III, Additional Information and Analysis.

Use the PDF search function and search for: fraudulent

Enjoy!

[fellowtraveller]

Dumb statement. It's true CRA is a hopeless den of red tape and idiotic bureaucratic management but so is much of the rest of the government. And most of the jobs actually don't involve direct contact with taxpayers or impact the taxes they pay. Like every other organization, it is filled with messengers, tech support types, internal services clerks, web site designers, marketing developers, communications specialists, translators, trainers, legal experts, and of course, those horrifying HR people.

Worse than many though since it is one of the departments excluded from detailed exam by the Auditor General.

Another is the cesspool at DIAND.

[Topaz]

Don't forget it only take one person to know your personal information including you social security number and your life could be a living hell!

[Michael Hardner]

Use the PDF search function and search for: fraudulent

Enjoy!

Wow. And how did you come by this report ?

[Shwa]

Wow. And how did you come by this report ?

Via a report from the U of T DIFA program.

Here, let me Google that for you.

I went to the AGO Office first, but realized that their reports were somewhat older and you wouldn't go for that. Plus, their search function is brutal. They way I figure if there is going to be Gov 2.0, let Google crawl the site and provide the search function. But seeing how much the Canadian Government has a boner for Micro$oft, it will likely be Bing.

[Argus]

Worse than many though since it is one of the departments excluded from detailed exam by the Auditor General.

Another is the cesspool at DIAND.

The AG's office has done a number of audits of the various programs at the CRA. The last one I read was on its silly new HR system - which pointed out the nitwits at HR hadn't even figured out what it would cost - hadn't tracked costs -and couldn't actually explain what they expected the results would be.

[Michael Hardner]

Via a report from the U of T DIFA program.

Here, let me Google that for you.

I went to the AGO Office first, but realized that their reports were somewhat older and you wouldn't go for that. Plus, their search function is brutal. They way I figure if there is going to be Gov 2.0, let Google crawl the site and provide the search function. But seeing how much the Canadian Government has a boner for Micro$oft, it will likely be Bing.

Of course, somebody has to think of looking for those keywords, to decide that that is specifically something worth measuring.

I don't feel that the employees are to blame for the situation in government, BTW, it's just an outcome from the way the system is set up.