How to store very important DND documents

[GostHacked]

This sounds too messed up to be true. Like someone wanted it to happen.

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/story....bb8&k=23930

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/sto...y/National/home

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/03/20/...nts-ottawa.html

The 26 blueprints, stamped with Department of National Defence markings, show everything from the location of the security fence to the floor plan of the new home of the Canadian Joint Incident Response Unit at CFB Trenton.

Blueprints for the new Anti-terrorism facility in Trenton have been found on the sidewalk trash on Bank street here in the downtown of Ottawa??? WHAT?? DND blueprints thrown out in the trash?? What the hell is going on here? I really do not think that this was just a simple mistake. Someone must have placed them deliberately there.

The blueprints were found March 13 by the spouse of Anthony Salloum, an analyst with the Rideau Institute, the left-leaning Ottawa think-tank. As the couple were on their way to dinner, Mr. Salloum's spouse noticed a large pile of garbage bags on the sidewalk, on top of which sat seven large rolled tubes of paper stamped with Defence Department markings.

Just out in the open eh? For all to see??

I was listening to CBC radion on my way into work, and the interview with the good Mr. Day. Reporter asked him is this was a concern of his. And he said that he will wait for more information from the investigation. Not really saying it is a concern.

HELL YES this is a concern. Someone just found blueprints for everything on your new anti-terror complex. Electric grid layout PC and networking information, what rooms are what. Even where the robots are stored.

[thermo]

Those bastards! how dare they not use the recycling!

[Army Guy]

It is serious,

But the building is not for the JTF, or any of our anti terror network...it's for the old NBCW company, based out somewhere else in ont, not the ottawa area., they gave them a new fancy name, and a new job of the nations NBCW clean-up unit , to put that into lay mens terms they wash things, like trucks, buildings, and outside areas that have been contaminated by nuclear, biological and chemical warfare... well they do a little more than that but most of there time is spent washing stuff....This unit used to be at each one of our brigade, but was not cost effective... not since the cold war ended...(9/11) the nation wanted to outfit this type of unit once again.... be kind of like finding the blue prints for the cleaners closet....and then making it sound like something bigger...

[AngusThermopyle]

Army Guy is correct for the the most part. He's also correct in saying they do decontamination work. It does go a bit deeper than that though. I spent 3 years on the NERT team in Halifax, it was interesting. They basically train for emergency response when a Nuclear incident occurs. They're trained to assess the situation and start corrective/containment action.

Its true that there are no great nation shaking secrets held by these teams. Its all pretty straight forward and in the public domain. You do get to see some really interesting information and movies on subjects like Chernobyl and such. Interesting but not sensitive material.

[GostHacked]

It is serious,

But the building is not for the JTF, or any of our anti terror network...it's for the old NBCW company, based out somewhere else in ont, not the ottawa area., they gave them a new fancy name, and a new job of the nations NBCW clean-up unit , to put that into lay mens terms they wash things, like trucks, buildings, and outside areas that have been contaminated by nuclear, biological and chemical warfare... well they do a little more than that but most of there time is spent washing stuff....This unit used to be at each one of our brigade, but was not cost effective... not since the cold war ended...(9/11) the nation wanted to outfit this type of unit once again.... be kind of like finding the blue prints for the cleaners closet....and then making it sound like something bigger...

The blueprints were dated March 5th 2007. Even in the article is saying the facility is part of the the antiterrorism units.

From the CBC article.

The plans, dated March 5, 2007, are for the new building for the Canadian Joint Incident Response Unit, created post-Sept. 11 to respond to large-scale attacks.

I had nowhere indicated it was the JTF nor had I indicated the new facility is based in Ottawa. Read my post again. The JTF is not part anti-terror as far as I know (they are special forces for foreign lands) But to play it down in any case causes me concern. Even from a military boy like yourself.

I hope heads roll for this.

And it seems from the article that this new place is part of the anti-terror network, it is a response team for the aftermath of an attack. If you manage to compromise this facility then you compromise the facilities ability to respond to a major attack. Hard to deploy when your security has been breached. This place could be a victim of the terror attack. Terror attack happens and at the same time the facility is attacked. So now you have the aftermath of an attack and the facility that is supposed to respond is out of action as well. Does this now cause you concern?

Think of it in a 9/11 scenario. One plane hits .. all the responders are there, then another plane hits taking out the frontline of search and rescue.

I know it is a 'could happen' scenario, but hopefully our boys in DND have these bases covered.

[Sean Hayward]

I find it somewhat suspicious that the person who found these documents just happens to work for the Rideau Institute, a left-wing group that is known for criticizing military spending and criticizing the military in general. I have also heard that these documents may have been for an alternate building plan that was rejected, and in that case they would not be dangerous at all.

[capricorn]

This sounds too messed up to be true. Like someone wanted it to happen.

Yeah, it is very suspicious, isn't it.

I was listening to CBC radion on my way into work, and the interview with the good Mr. Day. Reporter asked him is this was a concern of his. And he said that he will wait for more information from the investigation. Not really saying it is a concern.

I listened to to the "good Mr. Day" on a televised interview and in that interview he did say it is a serious concern. Do you really expect the CBC to air all of Day's comments or could it be there was some convenient editing done by the "good CBC staff"?

[capricorn]

I hope heads roll for this.

I sure hope so. I especially want to know how is it that the person who conveniently found the plans sitting on a curb among other garbage just happens to be a critic of military spending and contracting. The odds of this happening are astronomical. I smell a rat sitting somewhere at DND HQ on Colonel By Drive.

[jdobbin]

Yeah, it is very suspicious, isn't it.

I listened to to the "good Mr. Day" on a televised interview and in that interview he did say it is a serious concern. Do you really expect the CBC to air all of Day's comments or could it be there was some convenient editing done by the "good CBC staff"?

It is funny. I watched the same thing live when it was on. What editing are you referring to? That's all he said before moving on to other subjects.

[capricorn]

It is funny. I watched the same thing live when it was on. What editing are you referring to? That's all he said before moving on to other subjects.

Dobbin, follow the discussion. Gosthacked referred to CBC radio, not CBC TV. You cannot watch radio.

[jdobbin]

Dobbin, follow the discussion. Gosthacked referred to CBC radio, not CBC TV. You cannot watch radio.

It was the same lines used on both. You are suggesting something was edited. Tell me what you think was edited. Nothing was left out that I saw. It was wide-ranging news conference that dealt with China and the RCMP. Day said maybe a few sentences. It was the same sentences I saw on CTV and heard on Corus Radio later on and it is what is in the newspapers. You take every opportunity to bash the CBC. So what did they leave out?

Edited March 21, 2008 by jdobbin

[capricorn]

Dobbin, don't try to make a big deal out of this. CTV showed Day say that it was a big concern. CBC radio did not carry Day saying it was a big concern. Let's just leave at that. We can all draw our own conclusions.

[jdobbin]

Dobbin, don't try to make a big deal out of this. CTV showed Day say that it was a big concern. CBC radio did not carry Day saying it was a big concern. Let's just leave at that. We can all draw our own conclusions.

Baloney they didn't have him saying it wasn't a big deal. The top of the hours news had the same quote that Corus had on Thursday. The CBC even had the quote in the link in the original post in this thread.

[GostHacked]

Baloney they didn't have him saying it wasn't a big deal. The top of the hours news had the same quote that Corus had on Thursday. The CBC even had the quote in the link in the original post in this thread.

Let's move away from the CBC did what and move more back to wtf is going on with these trashed documents. After reading more articles in the paper and online, it has been mentioned that Day was relly concerned. And he should be, this should make him nervous as hell.

Capricorn - that is the first thing that came to mind, critics of the government just happen to find these trashed documents. Too convenient.

[jdobbin]

Capricorn - that is the first thing that came to mind, critics of the government just happen to find these trashed documents. Too convenient.

Since Ottawa is filled with lobbyists, why not?

Let the RCMP investigate if they think this was a set up by an organization critical of government. It seems to me if you leave trash in front of your building that says DOD, you might attract attention of someone who knows what DOD means.

[BubberMiley]

Typical of CPC apologists that, when they leave confidnetial documents for all to see, they blame the media for reporting it and the person who was looking through the trash.

[GostHacked]

Since Ottawa is filled with lobbyists, why not?

Let the RCMP investigate if they think this was a set up by an organization critical of government. It seems to me if you leave trash in front of your building that says DOD, you might attract attention of someone who knows what DOD means.

As far as I know there is only a recruiting center on Bank street, I am not aware of any other DND building on Bank street. I have walked it many times. They wer found in the trash on the sidewalk it seems. So stop apologizing for somone in DND not being able to do their job and dispose of things properly.

[Sean Hayward]

Typical of CPC apologists that, when they leave confidnetial documents for all to see, they blame the media for reporting it and the person who was looking through the trash.

Yeah, typical Conservative Party, trying to not take the blame for someone framing them or misrepresenting them. They do it all the time. (Sarcasm) How will they ever have a hope of a majority when there is such a broad coalition in Ottawa out to make them look like incompetent, socially conservative, anti-women, anti-human rights, anti-aboriginal, and so on? Certain interest groups set something like this up, in this case the Rideau Institute, for their own political reasons, the media plays along, as they have to, and then the Liberals throughout the country try to trap the Conservatives in a corner by critcizing any attempt to explain. This situation is slowly changing though; I remember back in the days before the 2006 election, CBC was much more anti-Conservative than it is now.

[jdobbin]

As far as I know there is only a recruiting center on Bank street, I am not aware of any other DND building on Bank street. I have walked it many times. They wer found in the trash on the sidewalk it seems. So stop apologizing for somone in DND not being able to do their job and dispose of things properly.

I never said there was a Defence department office on that street.

CTV reported yesterday that a contractor was also on that street and they had removed their nameplates from their doors just that day according to other tenants. Smith and Andersen Consulting Engineering was the name of the firm. Since you are in Ottawa, see if they are in that neighborhood. Wood Banani Bouthillette Parizeau is the other firm nearby. Both are listed as contractors.

I never said that Defence improperly disposed of the blueprints. However, the Auditor General said last year in her 2007 report said that information in the department was not being secured properly.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/sto...PStory/National

What do you think happened?