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Finally, the FSM gets some face time...


buffycat

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Well, it's certainly about time that the pasta patriarch be granted equal time in religious theorising!!

Pasta Monster Gets Academic Attention

""We have evidence that a Flying Spaghetti Monster created the universe. None of us, of course, were around to see it, but we have written accounts of it," Henderson wrote. As for scientific evidence to the contrary, "what our scientist does not realize is that every time he makes a measurement, the Flying Spaghetti Monster is there changing the results with His Noodly Appendage.""

***

LOL!!

Well, in all honesty the FSM is just as real as the big Daddy in the Sky!

;)

Edited by buffycat
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That's excellent Buffy!

At the very least it gets people to think about how "unreal" religion actually is how it is a fallacy to regard something as 'real' or 'truth' when in fact it is completely unknowable.

All we KNOW is scientific, therefore all that is TAUGHT should be science based.

Religion is very much like Santa Claus -- we teach our little children that a fat man brings them toys if they are good, and if they are not good, they get coal (or nothing).

As adults, church leaders teach us that a man in the sky will bring us immortality if we are good, and if we are not good we go to hell.

Same thing. Toys = immortality; coal = hell.

Be a good boy/girl/man/woman and you will recieve all the fun stuff that Santagod has in store for you!

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The lack of depth of atheistic "thought" never ceases to amaze me.

And those who follow with blind faith, a doctrine written by human beings millenia ago, are deep thinkers? :lol: x10.

Sometimes I think it's just strawmanism, but there just doesn't seem to be much more than that to be found, no matter how hard one looks for more behind the trite mockery.

Of course the Flying Spaghetti Monster is SUPPOSED to be a mockery of religion. Did you think people actually believed there is a pasta creature floating out in space? :lol:

"well yah" says Scotty "yah gotta believe in sumpthin or you'll fall for sumpthin else".

Come on, a pasta dude makes just as much sense as an unseeable, all knowing daddy (who, I might add, has never done even one damn provable thing) in the sky.

Religion sets itself up for a good mocking. I mock it daily. :lol:

Edited by Drea
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And those who follow with blind faith, a doctrine written by human beings millenia ago, are deep thinkers? :lol: x10.

Case in point. Do you think Augustine or thomas Merton or any of the countless numbers of Christian, Jewish, Buddhist, and Hindu thinkers and philosophers simply sat around in "blind faith?" That's what I mean...in your simplistic view, you need to believe that Deists are fools or emotional cripples unable to deal with the world without the crutch of some imaginary being. But that's a measure of your own lack of understanding, knowledge, and dare I say intelligence; it's not a reflection on God or people who believe in God.

I might add that it's the atheists who seem to spend all their time on this board proselytizing for atheism, and one can only wonder why?

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Case in point. Do you think Augustine or thomas Merton or any of the countless numbers of Christian, Jewish, Buddhist, and Hindu thinkers and philosophers simply sat around in "blind faith?" That's what I mean...in your simplistic view, you need to believe that Deists are fools or emotional cripples unable to deal with the world without the crutch of some imaginary being. But that's a measure of your own lack of understanding, knowledge, and dare I say intelligence; it's not a reflection on God or people who believe in God.

The greatest thinkers in the world still have no proof that there is an entity. This entity that people believe in has never, in all of human history, done anything proveable. That is my point. How can people believe in something unproveable?

I never said it was a crutch, those are your words. I believe people have been duped. No one wants to die, everyone would love to live on so "god" and religion were created. It makes sense -- to the primitive cave dweller who saw a leaf die and then come back in the spring, it looked like reincarnation or life after death. I understand why our primitive societies believed. I do not understand how people in this enlightened age, still believe. So sue me.

I might add that it's the atheists who seem to spend all their time on this board proselytizing for atheism, and one can only wonder why?

Because atheism is relatively new. 50 years ago you would be hard pressed to find someone who called themselves an atheist as they would've been shunned by their communities. Today it is much more acceptable to be a non believer, hence we talk about it more.

Edited by Drea
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Atheism is hardly new. I daresay you're as short on history as you are on the intellectual capacity needed to look beyond comic book caricatures of religion. Why not read up a bit on exactly what the thought behind Deism is, instead of just making up strawmen so you can chuckle to yourself while burning them? Anyone with even a passing knowledge of the volume and depth of thought embedded in religion just shakes their head at the shallow twaddle you're putting out. If you insist on making of God an enemy, then you ought at least to know what you're talking about.

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Atheism is hardly new. I daresay you're as short on history as you are on the intellectual capacity needed to look beyond comic book caricatures of religion. Why not read up a bit on exactly what the thought behind Deism is, instead of just making up strawmen so you can chuckle to yourself while burning them? Anyone with even a passing knowledge of the volume and depth of thought embedded in religion just shakes their head at the shallow twaddle you're putting out. If you insist on making of God an enemy, then you ought at least to know what you're talking about.

Any more insults to shell out sweety?

Hey I never invented the FSM. But thank you for the vote of confidence. You really are my biggest fan!

God is not an "enemy". God is nonexistent. How can something nonexistent be a foe?

Typical though... spewing insults when the debate goes over his head or beyond his limited comprehension.

*see I can spew out little insults too!

Too bad it does nothing for the conversation.

Over to you Scotty! I await the next round of insults... give it yer best shot. :lol: After all, you've got "god" on your side, all I've got is a made-up pasta dude...

Edited by Drea
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Well, it's certainly about time that the pasta patriarch be granted equal time in religious theorising!!

Pasta Monster Gets Academic Attention

""We have evidence that a Flying Spaghetti Monster created the universe. None of us, of course, were around to see it, but we have written accounts of it," Henderson wrote. As for scientific evidence to the contrary, "what our scientist does not realize is that every time he makes a measurement, the Flying Spaghetti Monster is there changing the results with His Noodly Appendage.""

***

LOL!!

Well, in all honesty the FSM is just as real as the big Daddy in the Sky!

;)

A flying spaghetti monster? How ridiculous. Everybody knows that the IPU is the one and only true god.

The Invisible Pink Unicorns is a being of great spiritual power. We know

this because she is capable of being invisible and pink at the same time.

Like all religions, the Faith of the Invisible Pink Unicorn is based

upon both logic and faith. We have faith that she is pink; we logically

know that she is invisible because we can't see her.

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This entity that people believe in has never, in all of human history, done anything proveable. That is my point. How can people believe in something unproveable?

That is an absolutely terrible, flawed argument.

Why do you have RRSP's? You can't prove that sun will rise tomorrow or that you'll live another week, so your wasting your time being an irrational fool right? There is actually no reasonable evidence to suggest either, it's just an assumption, or faith rather.

Try again, and you'll fail, like every atheist argument. They have fun pretending they are better with their pretense and snoddy attitudes, but realistically, they haven't every really made a convincing argument. And I've read a huge amount of atheist literature. And I'm mostly agnostic, I am completely willing to be convinced either way... Dawkins has yet to convince.

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You can't prove that sun will rise tomorrow or that you'll live another week, so your wasting your time being an irrational fool right?

There is evidence that the sun will rise tomorrow. And as for if you will live another week, we know that the average life expectancy is roughly 80 years old, so there is a very good probability that you will live another week (assuming your not over 80). I can't prove that the roulette wheel will land on black, but if someone offers me 10:1 odds, I'd be a fool not to take it.

There is actually no reasonable evidence to suggest either, it's just an assumption, or faith rather.

Try again, and you'll fail, like every atheist argument. They have fun pretending they are better with their pretense and snoddy attitudes, but realistically, they haven't every really made a convincing argument. And I've read a huge amount of atheist literature. And I'm mostly agnostic, I am completely willing to be convinced either way... Dawkins has yet to convince.

I think you are talking about "strong atheists" here, ie people who believe that God does not exist. There is obviously no way to prove that God does not exist. The weak atheist, which I'm guessing is what most atheists are in fact, would say that there is no proof either way. There is as much evidence for God as there is for the flying spaghetti monster. Would you consider yourself an atheist with respect to the flying spaghetti monster? Because that's how many atheists feel about God...

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That's what I mean...in your simplistic view, you need to believe that Deists are fools or emotional cripples unable to deal with the world without the crutch of some imaginary being.
If people were capable of understanding and dealing with the world, they wouldn't need to believe in religion. Sometimes people just accept the simplest answer when they don't understand or refuse to understand the right one.

Anyway, who said anything about deists? Deists believe a God got the ball rolling and is hands off. Atheists don't believe in theism that claims to know the mind and will of God, demands that society follow God will or suffer the punishments that God lays down. Christianity or Islam, it's all the same. They claim they know what God wants through scripture, then push their views on the world (creationism in schools, homosexuals should repress their feelings, etc...) and when society doesn't agree they make up punishments from God (God stopped protecting us so 9/11 happened, Katrina happened, Islamofascists murdering people are the weapon of God....etc).

It's all a ridiculous fabrication with no grounding in reality. By the most dangerous, it's used as a political tool for oppression, by the moderates in society, it requires strict respect and reverence.

All of this taught to children at an age where they absorb everything and are unable to defend themselves with knowledge and reason. It's poison to society and should be considered appalling by any rational mind.

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There is as much evidence for God as there is for the flying spaghetti monster. Would you consider yourself an atheist with respect to the flying spaghetti monster? Because that's how many atheists feel about God...
Or Zeus, or Thor, or Ra, or *insert any other God, but the God your parents raised you with*....

Huitzilopochtli, was the Aztec Sun God, perhaps we should start chopping people's hearts out to make sure the sun rises and sets everyday. You never know, we may anger him at some point in time and it's better safe then sorry when dealing with deities, right?

Edited by cybercoma
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"...It's all a ridiculous fabrication with no grounding in reality. By the most dangerous, it's used as a political tool for oppression, by the moderates in society, it requires strict respect and reverence.

All of this taught to children at an age where they absorb everything and are unable to defend themselves with knowledge and reason. It's poison to society and should be considered appalling by any rational mind.

Very nicely summed up.

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  • 4 weeks later...

I stand corrected...thanks LC!

I mock the people who follow the notion of an invisible daddy. As the daddy-thing is fictional it is difficult to mock it.

But never mind, you guys mock fiction all the time! Who was it mocking Dumbedork or whoever (a fictional character) for being gay. :lol: It's fiction sillies!

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I stand corrected...thanks LC!

I mock the people who follow the notion of an invisible daddy. As the daddy-thing is fictional it is difficult to mock it.

But never mind, you guys mock fiction all the time! Who was it mocking Dumbedork or whoever (a fictional character) for being gay. :lol: It's fiction sillies!

Prove that you exist. To me. Here. Now. You can't.

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I am god. I am watching you and judging you! Git down on yer knees and pray boy!

You cannot prove me wrong can you?

:lol:

edited to add -- I am doing a helluva lot more right at this second than your invisible daddy has done in over 2000 years.

Helluva guy that invisible daddy is!

Edited by Drea
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I am god. I am watching you and judging you! Git down on yer knees and pray boy!

You cannot prove me wrong can you?

:lol:

edited to add -- I am doing a helluva lot more right at this second than your invisible daddy has done in over 2000 years.

Helluva guy that invisible daddy is!

Sorry, I don't believe you. I suppose next you'll tell me you're the princess of darkness too? I need proof; not just more empty claims.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Well, it seems the Flying Spagetti Monster's noodly appendage has struck in Florida!

The Ledger

The group has sent dozens of e-mails to Polk County School Board members demanding that the idea of a Flying Spaghetti Monster creating the world receive classroom equal time with other views. The e-mail campaign began after four of seven board members said in November that they supported teaching intelligent design in addition to evolution.

snip

In an e-mail, Henderson said he can't explain the idea for the FSM.

"I tell people it was combination of lack of sleep and divine intervention," Henderson said. "But the church has evolved into what it is today."

Henderson said he put out the open letter in 2005 to the Kansas School Board as a joke and it "snowballed from there."

Now, Henderson said there are more than a million Google results for Flying Spaghetti Monster.

"No telling where we will be in 10 years, 100 years, 1,000 years," Henderson wrote. "I heard Christianity started as a joke, too ... so who knows?"

****

Hee hee hee!! :D

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All of this taught to children at an age where they absorb everything and are unable to defend themselves with knowledge and reason. It's poison to society and should be considered appalling by any rational mind.

Isn't this what the gay rights movement is doing? The fact of the matter is, though, teaching children the truth about God and Jesus has done much to improve society and many people have lived good, safe and productive lives because of Christianity. Feel free to pick up any history book on non-Christian societies to see what life was once like; look at ancient Rome, China, etc. look at what life used to be like for pre-Contact Indians--it was short and brutal, people had no rights, and they practiced witchcraft and demon worship. You just don't get it; you just don't understand how good your life is because of the influence of Christianity on the creation of our society; yet you would still rather see it done away with, and see society slide back into the lawlessness and depravity of pagan cultures of the past.

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The Chinese people, imo, have the most logical system of the entire planet... I hope they eventually take over the world.

Ancient Chinese Religion

Throughout human history, most civilizations have used religion to explain the things they cannot understand, such as the origins and nature of the universe. The early Chinese looked to their observations of the natural world as well as their ancestors for these answers. As time passed, religion in China evolved. Slowly, the early gods were forgotten and replaced with the "Three Doctrines" of Confucianism, Taoism and Buddhism -- ideologies that work both as philosophies and as religions.
The Three Doctrines

There were three ideologies that became important in Chinese religion. Taoism and Confucianism were native to China and developed in isolation. These three ideologies can be viewed from an intellectual standpoint as philosophies. However, they also have a spiritual element, so scholars also classify them as religions. The third doctrine, Buddhism, was imported from India.

Confucianism

Confucius was born in 551 BC and grew up to become a politician and philosopher. He was by no means attempting to establish a religion, but his teachings would evolve long after his death. While Confucius was alive, the Chou Dynasty started to decay. It was riddled with corruption and internal conflict. Confucius experienced the corruption of the state firsthand when he held a position in the government. He believed that the decline was occurring because the Chinese had abandoned the traditional ways of thinking and living their lives. The old concepts of honor, politeness, morality and social roles had been forgotten. Confucius encouraged his students and followers to reestablish these traditional ideas.

Taoism

The concept of Tao existed in China since the early stages of its religious development. Tao is literally translated as "the path" or "the way." The term has no conclusive definition, but refers to a wide force in nature and is considered the source of all things.

Taoism developed around the same time as Confucianism. According to legends, the most consequential Taoist writing was composed by Lao-tzu. Lao-tzu was born c. 600 BC and later became a librarian for the royal court in Loyang. He was wise enough to see that the Chou Dynasty was nearing its downfall, so he packed up his things and headed west. As he approached the boundary of Chinese territory, a border guard stopped Lao-Tzu and asked him to write down his wisdoms. Lao-Tzu obliged him by writing a book. Then the sage left China for good. This book, which scholars possess today, contains profound sayings written in a simple style.

Taoism in its purist form calls the follower to pursue Tao. This means that he or she should not try to alter nature or force it to do something it was not meant to do. Instead, a follower must remain inactive and avoid making plans. For example, actions considered contrary to Tao included building a house or damming a river. It was also against Tao to deny the good nature of humanity. This meant that the artificial rules made by Confucianism were unnecessary.

Most Taoists were members of the educated elite. However, some of the less educated classes learned about Taoism and altered it somewhat. Their beliefs included more magic and alchemy than the purest form of Taoism.

Buddhism

Buddhism was founded in Indian in the 500's BC by Siddharta Gautana. He was later called "the Enlightened One," or Buddha. The religion came to China along the Silk Road, a trade route that went through China and lead to foreign markets during the Han Dynasty. Buddhism was at first considered to be part of Taoism because the two religions were so similar. However, a number of Buddhist monks came from India to China, and kept the religion from being swallowed by Taoism. Buddhism encourages the follower to learn to throw off self-interest. Through mediation and right living, a Buddhist can reach Nirvana, or the absence of suffering.

The Chinese altered Buddhism somewhat over time. They came to believe that Nirvana was a physical paradise. Also, the Chinese believed that a few individuals who had reached Nirvana had returned to help and guide humans. Buddhism became a very popular religion throughout China and was supported by the patronage of the wealthy.

The coming of Buddhism opened China up to new and increasing trade markets with India. It also gave the Chinese a new perspective on their lives. Buddhism is still practiced in China today.

All three of these religious philosophies were not intolerant of one another, although they did not always agree. Oftentimes, Chinese people subscribed to more than one at a time. Generally, all three influence one another in some way.

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The Chinese people, imo, have the most logical system of the entire planet... I hope they eventually take over the world.

They may well take over the world but it won't be under the tenet of some ancient religion. The isolationism that the old China engaged in was the primary reason it came under the heal of western imperialism. If we all followed Taoism we would still be in the fifth century BC.

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Isn't this what the gay rights movement is doing? The fact of the matter is, though, teaching children the truth about God and Jesus has done much to improve society and many people have lived good, safe and productive lives because of Christianity. Feel free to pick up any history book on non-Christian societies to see what life was once like; look at ancient Rome, China, etc. look at what life used to be like for pre-Contact Indians--it was short and brutal, people had no rights, and they practiced witchcraft and demon worship. You just don't get it; you just don't understand how good your life is because of the influence of Christianity on the creation of our society; yet you would still rather see it done away with, and see society slide back into the lawlessness and depravity of pagan cultures of the past.

You've made it quite clear through the bulk of your posts where your beliefs would lead our society. Your debasement of women and homosexuals is all I need to know that YOUR brand of Christianity is doing more harm than good in society.

Do you honestly believe that without labeling infants we'll no longer have human rights and freedoms? Do you truly think that by teaching children as they grow up the gamut of religious beliefs, and allowing them to eventually decide for themselves, people will practice "witchcraft and demon worship"?

And what the hell is witchcraft and demon worship? Do you actually believe in mystical nonsense and magic? Do you think voodoo pincushions have an actual affect on people?

Society has an established set of laws, with or without TELLING children what religion they are before they're able to decide for themselves.

As Steven Weinberg said, "Religion is an insult to human dignity. Without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." The bulk of your posts illustrates this flawlessly. I'm sure you're a good person, trying to do good things, but it is your religious teaching that has fooled you into believing that oppressing and debasing women and homosexuals is good.

I don't think religion should be erased from our memories, or our history; however, I think it's terribly unfair to the world to label children as being of a certain faith before they're even capable of comprehending that title. To say a child is of a certain philosophical doctrine is ridiculous. You don't call a child a communist, socialist or capitalist based on what their parents beliefs. It's equally absurd, and dare I say destructive to society, to label a child with a religion before they're fully capable of understand it.

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