Accountability Now

You could be right but I'm tainted by the fact that someone pays for these studies to be done thus an agenda is always in place.

Hey...go ahead and believe every report out there if you want. Most reports are flawed statistically because they are trying to prove a point. Why is it that everything causes cancer? Are eggs good or bad for you? Are we getting healthier or more sick? You will find stats to prove any of these

And a whole bunch more.

Most land was not taken...it was negotiated by treaty. The treaties clearly state they give up land for money which was $5 per head per year. 30-40 years ago (maybe sooner) they were still giving out $5 per head....I know this from an RCMP officer who was there. In this time we introduced lawyers and lobbyists who administer the racist white guilt to sway what the natives are actually owed. Regardless of what side you take on this you have to recognize that these native groups could of negotiated treaties with the British or been wiped out by the Americans. It was after the war of 1812 that the natives started to realize this and started the process. Now we are being punished because we were civil and tried to make a deal to see both groups co-exist. Wow...talk about your all time backfires!

Yes they count. The point of my argument was that you have to be sure you separate our healthiness from the health system. Maybe there is a better way to word it. All I know is that Japan is going to rank lowest in road accidents because no one drives there (they all take subways and trains). Also they have a ban on weapons so they are less likely to die that way. I agree that the US won't top a list for disease or risk factors but the article you supplied was very broad and I felt was misleading. It's great that you went and supplied all sorts of other evidence from other places but it doesn't change my stance on this article. Overall I have a problem with all these studies because statistics can prove anything you want. Most studies will be adjusted to get the answers they want because certain lobby groups are paying to see it this way. Remember....if there are as many men as women in our world then we all have one testicle and one boob!

Sorry for jumping in late on this but the thing I don't get is how this study makes a claim on how healthy people are by using stats like violence or road collisions. Having high deaths in those categories may mean they are violent or poor drivers but doesn't necessarily mean they are unhealthy. You could have an otherwise healthy guy die in a crash and now he's put on the unhealthy chart? Furthermore, this thread seems to be focused on the thought that since the article says Americans die more that their health care system is not as good. Again...I would again argue this isn't the case. I trust other stats might prove this position but I don't think this article does. Personally I do think that Canada's system is better than the US not because we have better doctors or better technology but because our system reaches all of our population. I am the first to say that the US leads the way in technology and availability of services but that doesn't mean their system works for all which tends to be the guideline for most of these rankings.

I agree. We can't hold provinces accountable for the revenues they make as they will change based on so many factors globally. We can however hold provinces accountable for their costs. People from the west have a stereotype of Quebecers that they want everything subsidized by the government (education, early retirement, etc). I don't know enough about the formula for equalization or about Quebec's spending habits but I do feel strongly about all provinces being fiscally responsible

LOL!

Here is an online petition from Taxpayer.com. I thought it was interesting as its the first group I have seen to actually suggest some ideas rather than the same old stuff. If Canadians are serious about ending poverty on aboriginal reserves, it’s time for a new approach. At a recent news conference the CTF laid out five ideas for change: Instead of continuing to fund people to stay in high unemployment reserves in the middle of nowhere, aim assistance at people – especially young people – to help them transition to where there are jobs and opportunities. Chiefs can “hunger strike” if they choose but that does not exempt them from accountability. Audits are an appropriate response to millions in unaccounted funds. Pilot projects should be initiated whereby reserve funding flows to the citizens. Chiefs and councillors can then tax their citizens in order to fund services. Transfer more control of existing reserve land to the bands. And let the people, not the band own their own homes. Stop creating more programs and laws that single aboriginal people out – treat all Canadians the same. http://taxpayer.com/federal/aboriginal-policy-reform?utm_source=Action+Updates&utm_campaign=052128ad65-Response_to_Idle_No_More_g_1_18_2013&utm_medium=email

Here is a quote from a CBC article that I found at http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/aboriginals/faqs.html Do aboriginals get free post-secondary education? Again, it depends. And again, Inuit and Métis are exempted from the free post-secondary education that some Status Indians receive. This is how it works: Ottawa provides education money to Indian bands, which in turn decide whose education to finance. "Not everyone is entitled to the money … There's a cap. The money has been frozen for 20 years or so," says Victoria De La Ronde, director of treaty policy with the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs. Because there is only so much money for post-secondary education, she says some bands may decide to fund only those pursuing their first degree, or perhaps only those living on the reserve. So based on this my cousin shouldn't have received free education but he did. Not sure if he's full of shit or found some loop hole. The reserves do get money for education but its capped so they have to decide who gets what. I trust the Cheifs famility gets first crack!

I too live in the discussed area so I have taken a little more interest that normal. These guys are really giving the other reserves a bad name! They were given a reserve. They sold the reserve. The band moves to other reserves and official shuts down the band in 1909. In 1997 they revive the band hoping to cash in on some white man guilt. They brought their case to the Alberta Court (Queens Bench) and were turned down. They appealled to the Supreme Court in 2008 and were unanimously struck down. But they are still fighting this cause. This is embarrassing. There is no other word for it.

Not sure what your arguement here is or if you are agreeing with me. The white Canuck leaseholders have their hand out according to the business deal they make. And if they want more when they don't deserve it then the company or the courts tell them to go pound sand. Bottom line is that if the business deal says they are owed 'x' amount then that's what they should get paid. The free university education that is given to Natives and some Metis. I won't lie and say that I know all of them get it but my one buddy is native and he had his university paid so and so did my cousin who is Metis. They could be the exception though. Regardless...even if education is not paid for then invest in your people for long term gain. I didn't have my university paid for and I came from a low income family. Through student loans I made my way through and now I own a succesful business. Its all about investing in yourself.

Guilty No More works too. I've been thinking about the De Beers thing. I am making an assumption but I have to believe its correct....the amount of money to be transferred was a lump sum agreed at the start of the mining process. Yes? No? What if De Beers went in and lost money on the project? Would Attawapiskat have paid De Beers because apparently they are partners. I am quite certain that is not the case. Again...this situation shows that some people want all the reward but no risk. Let me ask this....what is a diamond worth (moreover a diamond in the ground)? Its worth nothing!! Its worth nothing until someone spends millions of their dollars on building facilities and equipment to extract those diamonds and then set up businesses to sell the product. Once all those costs have been spent then the diamond is worth something. And that is when the reserves have their hands out. How many reserves invest their own money to develop these resources. And if they don't want the resources developed then why did they sign the deal with De Beers in the first place. Simple case of wanting their cake and eating it too (much like Theif Theresa's hunger strike) According to an article I read, The Attawapiskat are to receive $30M over the ten year expcetancy of the project. No one actually knows how much it is because the terms of the deal do not allow those terms to be divulged. What is factual is that $51 million dollars has been paid by De Beers to local Attawapiskat contractors to help build the mine. Addiitonally the mine employs over 100 Attawapiskat people. No matter what it is (good or bad) the Attiwapiskat agreed to it. This was a business deal. Not a goverment deal so if they aren't happy with the deals they make then they need to look in the mirror. Use their free education to train reserve people in law, business or marketing so that they can manage these opportunities. Look at other reserves like the Onion Lake band (who has their own oil company) and the Osoyoos band (who own golf course and wineries). They have invested in themselves with the opportunities and money given to them and good for them....they are successful. Entitled No More or Guilty No More or whatever you want to call it is not an Indian bashing thing. It about changing the system so that Natives can actually help themselves because the current system is just not working. They have a sense of entitlment to this country even though EVERY treaty (and yes I have read them) clearly indicates that in exchange for compensation, they will surrender all lands and their rights to the lands except for their reserves. If they want to let business like De Beers come into their reserves then that is a business deal which they are responsible for and for which they take the risk. The compensation they have received from the government has been more than fair considering they signed a deal saying they would get $5 per person per year. If they want us to objectively honor the deals then we will. I agree with WIP in that deals were made and that we need to honor the deals. However, just like De Beers, it will always be that the deal is never good enough. That is the entitlement that needs to stop.

There goes WIP again....answering questions that no one asked him. To answer your question, we are entitled to NOTHING which is why the group is called Entitled No More. I didn't create the group just thought it was interesting. I couldn't disagree with you more when you said that we were forced into the treaties. History knows that the natives felt it was either that or death. So now we are being criticized for negotiating versus simply wiping them out? Since you are such an expert on treaties, please tell me what it says about not interfering or disputing the settlers. WIP...I actually hope you leave because I'm getting dumber just listening to you

You should add that this person would have to be a mayor that showed fiscal responsibility and helped his/her people

I like it

It's sort of "two wrongs don't make a right".

Come to think of it the one you are looking for is Occupy Wall Street

Sure throw that in the mix too. I guess the only difference is that we all have a chance to be rich but we don't all have a chance to get Native handouts. There people of all races are rich or get undeserved bonuses. Having said that I can see your point

No...this is different. Its a Facebook link that is intened to unite the silent majority. The link is above....check it out.

I saw there is a group forming on Facebook which is intended to rival the Idle No More movement. I thought I would share it for discussion. http://www.facebook.com/wheresthemoneygoing?ref=stream

So.....you're saying that because Harper has his seat in Calgary that he's Alberta? He was born and raised in Toronto....or did you not know that? And he's only one guy. Currently there are 165 Conservatives in power. Of which 73 are from Ontario!!!!!! If you take the Conservatives from Alberta (26), BC (21), Saskatchewan(13) and Manitoba (11)....you still only have 71. Ontario can vote any way it wants and the Entire West can't do anything about it!! Furthermore, the Oil companies do sell the oil in USD and their costs are in CDN dollars. As such when the dollar is low that means it gets converted to less CDN which means less profit! When the USD is high then they get more CDN dollars for their USD which means more profit. Which one do you think the oil companies want?????? Seriously....your argument is horrible. I can agree that a high CDN dollar is not good for manufacturing just like its not good for oil but I will never agree that "certain provinces" are inflating the price of the dollar to their benefit.

I think the guy only wanted to come and make a presence. If he came to argue, then he was horribly prepared! I think he's alot like most Canadians in that we disapprove of the Native front but we don't know exactly how to approach it. Good for him for doing it but next time he should be more prepared.

Actaully....we were British, French and Native....not just British. It was the storied fable where the Brits, French and natives were all fighting against each other and then decided to join forces to defend the land against the Yanks. I agree completely that it wasn't Canada at the time but that war and the ideals behind fighting that war is what Canada was based on. Even today its supposed to be something that brought the three groups together but Quebec and the Natives still want out of Canada even though they had both given into the Brits for rights to Canada. Furthermore, if the Brits hadn't fought back against the Yanks then we'd all be one big country....which would mean that Bush-Cheney would have nothing to mock us about! Lol. Sorry for intitally starting this arguement. It was all in good fun but I see it really has gotten away from the original thread.

No...they stayed away from the topic. When they say "This is Papaschase land" they are actually referring to reserve land and NOT the typical native rant referring to all of Canada being their land. The Papaschase used to have a reserve on the Southside of Edmonton a long time ago (1880s) but the cheifs and band member of that time sold their land and moved to the Enoch reserve (west of Edmonton). Modern day natives of the Papaschase band (or so called band) are trying to get more out of the government with a false land claim however the Supreme Court unanimously shut them down and doesn't even recognize them as a legal band. Here's a good article on it: http://www.calgarysun.com/2013/01/16/gunter-papaschase-grievances-are-largely-illusory I stick to my earlier point. Idle No More has less to do with a common goal or objective points....it is solely an opportunity to bring up any grievance (right or wrong) against the 'white man'. Keep in mind the 'white man' now consists of black, brown, yellow....just saying.